Jim Root: How to Turn Fishing Into a Full-Time Career

Tom Rowland Podcast — Episode 938: Jim Root

In this episode: turning fishing into a full-time career, a book royalty deal that went wrong, chasing giant trevally in the Ring of Fire, losing the Weather Underground sponsorship, walking away from TV to be present for his kids, and the new show Just Landed — in the exact words spoken.

00:00 · Cold Open

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That's starbrite.com, and get your boat dialed in for the season. From The Seychelles to The Keys, I trust Nikon binoculars to find fish fast. Visit nikonusa.com and upgrade your line of sight. I thought I was covered, but I wasn't. HH Insurance showed me that my old policy did not cover The Bahamas or nighttime navigation, two major gaps that could have cost me a lot. Jake and Landon fixed it fast. They know charter policies better than anyone I've ever worked with. Call (727) 498-5551 or visit hhinsgroup.com and tell them Tom Roland sent you. Trusted enough to go with me to The Seychelles, my Danco pliers are a staple in my kit. Check out dancopliers.com and build yours today. Hey, everybody. Welcome to the Tom Roland podcast brought to you by StarBright. Today, we have a very interesting gentleman, somebody that I have not run across before.

There aren't that many in the fishing world that I'd I've run across that I just have not heard of and I haven't, met before, but this one was a very pleasant introduction. I really enjoyed my conversation that I just had with Jim Root. Jim Root, I don't know how I haven't run into him. He's done a tremendous amount of writing, and he has, he's been around. You probably read some of the stuff that he's written over the years if you are, reading stuff fishing related about weather or small mouth bass or lots of other things. But just for whatever reason, our worlds have not collided, but I felt like I made a friend today. And I think you're gonna like Jim Root as well. He is the host of a new show that's coming out called Just Landed. It's gonna be on Amazon and YouTube.

Very interesting conversation about how he got started, in the fishing world from growing up and then turning into someone who had a show on the outdoor channel called bragging rights and now took a break from that and is now launching a new show called Just Landed, which sounds very interesting. So here we go with conversation with my new friend, Jim Root.

Jim Root: Hi, Jim Root, and this is Tom Rolling podcast.

Tom Rowland: Jim, what's going on, man? How are you?

Jim Root: Good, man. How are you doing?

Tom Rowland: I'm doing I'm doing well. I'm doing well. I'm I'm, happy to

Jim Root: catch you. You too. Thanks for having me on today.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. No problem. So, it's funny to, you know, to to come across a fisherman that I don't really know, and and you are one of those. So give me a little background on on, your background in in fishing, and I know you're a competitive tournament fisherman. How did that happen? How did you end up there?

03:43 · From a River in Oxford, New York, to a Grandfather’s Tiger Muskie Record

Jim Root: It's kind of a great story, actually. So I I grew up in very rural Upstate New York, Oxford, actually. Graduated with

Tom Rowland: Is that anywhere near, Lake Placid? That's that's where I'm familiar with, that area.

Jim Root: Way far south. That's, like, four or five hours away. So if you drew a straight line between, like, Syracuse and Albany, I would be located roughly in the middle, Okay. A little south of that.

Tom Rowland: I've been to both of those places. Yeah. In a lacrosse team for my son. Yeah. Big lacrosse areas up there.

Jim Root: And, and, you know, back then, three video games and stuff like that, we spent a lot of time outside. We had a beautiful river that ran through my hometown, and my parents were, I guess, kind and trusting enough to let us just go and fish down there. And so I did a lot of fishing as a kid. And then as I got older, I really started to gravitate toward that even more. My grandfather held the state record for the tiger muskie in West Virginia for, like, fifty six years. And even to this day, it's a divided record now. There's some record for length and a record for weight. He caught that fish on Lincoln's birthday. He was, like, super proud of that. Hung on the mantle forever. And so I then sort of became driven by these big predator fish like northerns, muskie, and, started really targeting them.

Got out of college with a bachelor's of science in English and creative writing and didn't really know what I wanted to do. Sort of bombed around different jobs and, ended up on a not for profit board. And I was working in the same field, and, they wanted to do some new fundraisers. And so I was looking, and I was like, oh, well, this one's kinda cool. There's a fishing tournament. And I saw the prize money and how many boats they were anticipating. I was like, wait a minute. They're raising a lot of money. So I'll go fish in the tournament and check it out and see, like, what it's like. Fished in the tournament and had a lot of fun and started looking for other tournaments and saw there were all these, like, bass trails that I didn't know about, like the ABA or the BFLs, like, things like that.

And so I was like, I think I just wanna go fish a couple bass tournaments just to see, like, what that's like. Fished a couple of them, had a blast, did well, and I was like, I think I'm gonna fish the whole trail. So I pitched the ABA, did really well in the ABA, qualified for the national championship in Santee Cooper, went down there, and that was, like, my first real taste of this is what it would be like to work in the industry full time. Like, we rented a house. There was eight of us. You know, you practice for four days. You fish for three. It's like you're basically fishing for a living. And I was like, I have to find a way to do this full time. And I kinda focused on my writing because, you know, back then, especially, there weren't a lot of people who could fish with the right whale. And so I very quickly was able to, like, get sponsored.

I was sponsored by, Weather Underground and The Weather Channel and started once I was sponsored by them and writing for them, I I started writing for everyone. I was writing for Bass. I was writing for BAM, Field and Stream, Outdoor Life. Just started and then I started doing some other stuff too, writing for, like, other websites and web publications. I think the first shot I ever got to write an article was it in the fishing industry, I should say, alone, was for Raw Fish, Tim Hein out of Canada. And then, it's kinda weird. Like, Weather Underground merged with, like, Weather Channel and all these other companies, and then they started weeding out their marketing departments. And they were, like they got rid of my champion, the guy that signed me and really wanted to do that thing.

And then I so I ended up losing my sponsorship, and I was like, I can either try to make a living just fishing full time as a creator, or I can go get a job and continue to, like, fish the tour. I was fishing the opens and the EverStart series back then. And I decided to just try to focus on being on the water as much as I could in writing and shooting videos, and stuff like that. Signed a book deal in February to write a book about smallmouth bass with a publishing company. This was the first time in my life I learned a valuable lesson about reading the fine print in your contracts because I thought I was doing the right thing. I really did. I thought because they offered me two options. I can either take this lump sum payment upfront, right, or I could take a very, very small it was, like, $1,500, right, to start it. No. It was 1,500 total.

I got $7.50 when I started, $7.50 when I ended, and then I got a royalty deal where I got paid x number of money for every book that was sold. And I really I thought, you know what? For the first time in my life, I'm gonna do, like, the smart thing and take the royalty deal. You know? And I leveraged all my contacts in the industry, like Brandon Palenik, Austin Felix, everyone. And they always led me to another person and then another person and another person. And eventually, I got connected to Greg Mangus, who is an absolute legend in the smallmouth fishing world. Does not get enough credit. Arguably, the greatest smallmouth fisherman that ever lived and is still alive and still catch them. Greg connected me and then Mark Zona and Kevin Mandan. I fished with Zona. That was the last chapter in my book.

And I wrote that last chapter at Ryan McCall's house, after I got off the water with Zona, which is Pearl Harbor Bay. It was freezing and turned in the book. I was a month late, but they let us slide. Book came out during Shark Week the following year. Hit Amazon. I was number one. I was crushing it. I was crushing it. And, Zona had Zona's awesome, first of all. He really he's the kindest person I've ever met in the fishing industry. Even he even wrote the forward for me in in the book, which is amazing. Nice. This is the part that I've never talked about openly what happened next. And that was when you sign a royalty deal with a publishing company, as soon as your royalty kicks in, they stop pushing your book, and they stop selling it because the profit isn't really there for them anymore.

So to this day, I have never made a nickel off of that book beyond the $1,500 that I was paid to write. It. And it was the hardest thing I've ever done writing that book. I will never write another unless I write, like, some memoir, right, at the end. Right. I'm like, this is my this is my life in a nutshell. Tried without success to get the rights to that book back. I don't know that I'll ever be able to get it back. But you can still it's still on Amazon right now. It's still super high rated.

12:26 · The Book Royalty Lesson: When the Sales Fall Off a Cliff

Tom Rowland: So as soon as the as soon as the royalty kicks in, they say, okay. We've we've made as much money off of this book as we're going to. We're not spending any more money. And so you saw the sales crush it and then just Traumatic

Jim Root: drop. Just like if you were riding the Tower Of Terror at Disneyland. And and one minute you're on the 13th Floor, and the next minute you're at okay. We hit the bottom. Wow. Like, just a straight

Tom Rowland: So if you had it if you had it to do over again, what would

Jim Root: you do? Complicated because I gotta tell you what happened next. So but and to answer your question, I would have taken the lump sum payment upfront. Right? Because then I would have made something off of that book. Mhmm. While writing that book, I got connected to a woman named Amy Gable who was working for Kinatini Canoes in Pennsylvania. And I would and so the book was divided in half. Half of the book was, like, how to like, how to fish a swimbait, how to fish a jerkbait. And then the second half of that book was trips that I went on, where I fished in Zona. I fished in Mille Lacs with Austin Felix. I fished in the greatest smallmouth lake of my life and still to this day have refused to name it publicly because it's too small, and I didn't want it to get destroyed. So I what I've told people all the time is if you wanna fish that lake, you call Tony DiFilippo.

He's the guy who took me, and he's in the he's in Traverse City, Michigan. Tony will take you to that lake. And if Tony wants to tell you what it is, he can tell you what it is. But I for the sake of my own conscience, I'm not gonna tell people the name of the lake. Too good, too good, stupid good. And so small, like, if it if the wind is absolutely ripping, you're not gonna get blown off. That's why I can't, like, in good conscience, tell people, oh, this is the name of it. And in fact, I shot an episode I'm getting ahead of myself. I shot an episode of a TV show that I used to host called Real Bragging Rights on that body of water. And I told everyone in the beginning of the show, I wrote about this place in my book, and I'm gonna finally, like, spill the tea. At the end of the show, I'm gonna tell you the name. And at the end of the show, they're like, alright. Well, what's the name?

And I had this, like, overwhelming sense of guilt come over me, and I was like, I can't do it. I'm sorry. I just can't tell you. And then my phone absolutely blew up for, like, forty five minutes after that with guys who were local there that I've never even spoke with before, and they were like, just saw that show. Thank you so much for not naming that lake. It's a beautiful lake. You're right. You would have blown it up if you had done that. I never got so many people reach out to me following an episode as I did that day. And just imagine if I had named it, they they would have absolutely murdered me. Right? Oh my god.

Tom Rowland: You had twice as many people calling you. That's for sure.

15:33 · A Blade Bait, a Dream Job Writing, and Chasing GTs in the Ring of Fire

Jim Root: But so Amy had this little bait. It was a little blade bait, and she was like, you should check out this bait. So I wrote about I fished that bait. I caught some good fish on it. I wrote about that bait. When the book came out, the owners of that bait company were like, hey. We saw you wrote about our bait. That's pretty cool. Why don't you come visit us? So I went up to their house in Vermont. Long story short, they're short, they were like, what are you what are you doing with your life? And I was like, honestly, I really, I don't know. Like, you know, I used to think I wanted to fish the tour. Now I think I just wanna, like, fish for a living if I can as a content creator. I have this idea for a TV show. I don't know how to get it off the ground. They're like, well, tell us about the show. What's it called? So the show's called bragging rights.

Because growing up, like, we didn't really have anything, so we just bet on every like, I bet you that girl won't answer you, or I bet you can't make two, three pointers. Like, whatever. I was like, I think it'd be cool. Like, I'll take some of my friends. We'll go fishing. We'll place a stupid bet. You know? Loser jumps in the creek. Whatever. They're like, that sounds pretty cool, actually. And they they said, we'll help you start your own production company. We'll seed it, and we have contacts names too. We can get your show off the ground, and they did. They got my show on, OSG, Outdoor Channel Sports with Channel World Fishing Network. And real fast, like, within four weeks, I was the number one show on Friday night prime time.

Tom Rowland: Wow.

Jim Root: And I was having a blast. It was like a dream come true. You know? And then I'll never forget. I was in I was starting to have more of that guilt about, like, am I really am I doing a good thing with this show or not? Mhmm. And we were in I went to did you see that planet Earth documentary where the giant are coming out of the water and they're eating the birds?

Tom Rowland: Oh, yeah.

Jim Root: Well, I saw that too, and then I was like, I have to catch GTs. And not only do I have to catch GTs, I gotta catch the hardest fighting GTs in the world. Where are they're in the Ring Of Fire? Okay. Well, then I have to go to the Ring Of Fire. And in the Ring Of Fire, in in Komodo National Park, there's only one guy in the world who can fish there. His name is Reza. And I was like, that's where I need to go. And the reason why those GTs are the hardest fighting in the world is because they live in 30 to 40 knots of current. So you're not just fighting this incredible fish. You're fighting thirty, forty knots while you're trying to reel this thing in.

Tom Rowland: Wow.

Jim Root: Most intensity I've ever felt, but, I would in a second

Tom Rowland: What what makes the current run so far?

Jim Root: I have absolutely no idea. But, I mean, you look it looks like you're in the ocean. But as soon as you look down, you can you can see it. It's like man, it is ripping through there. And even though I landed I think the biggest one I landed was, like, fifty kilos. There's a picture of me holding it on social and holding it on my waist like this.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. That's a good

Jim Root: biggest one that I have that I lost, though, was on the last day, and there's some footage of that fish. And I'm telling you right now, it looks like the size of a Toyota pickup truck hitting my because we were fishing with plugs. We're hit these are top water bikes.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. And

Jim Root: the water absolutely explodes for, like, three seconds. And I helped him for about two seconds, and then he came off. You're surrounded by coral. It's razor sharp. They know. But when that fish came off, I asked Reza how how big was that fish. He was like, that was very, very big GT, like, over a 100 kilos. Like, monster GT.

Tom Rowland: So a 100 kilos, that's 200 two twenty? I mean Is that about right?

Jim Root: Yeah. It looked like a big giant bluefin. I mean, the explosion.

19:41 · Tom’s Christmas Island Story and the Tackle That Handles Giant Trevally

Tom Rowland: I was in Christmas Island. The the reason that's not surprising to me I mean, that's a massive, massive fish, and I've never seen one that big. But I did, I was in Christmas Island, and I had this experience where these two big GTs were cruising down the shoreline. And I was in marathon shape, and I was training for for a marathon so I could run pretty well. And so I grabbed my rod, and I ran down the beach in front of them far enough to where I could strip all the line off the fly rod, stand in front of them, throw a cast, and they're there. You know, so I didn't get very far in front of them. I mean, just enough time to do that. And they come rushing up on on the fly and they don't eat it. And then they go on down the shoreline. So I reel everything up, and I run down the shoreline again. And it was a long shoreline.

And I ran ran ran and I passed them, and I'm like, I need more time this time. So I keep running, keep running, keep running, keep running. And I finally get out there. I get all the line off, and and I make a cast, and they rush up on it and they miss it by I mean, just get right to the fly and then just turn away, like, the fraction of an inch away from eating it, but they don't eat it. And the mouth is huge, and and it's a big, big fish. So I do it again. I run down there, and I see the guide. He he's bringing the boat around. He kinda sees what's going on, and he's he's way out there, and he's he's coming around. I do this four or five times. I must have run probably close to four or five months. I mean, I was you were going way down there, but I was so excited. My heart was just beating out of my chest. And I get back in the boat, and I never caught those fish.

And, he said he said, those are big fish. And, you know, there's a little bit of a of a a language barrier. But I was like, yeah. Those those were. And he's like, you're waiting. And I was like, yeah. And he said, they get big. And, I said, really? How big? He said, three hundred pounds, and they eat people. That's what he said.

Jim Root: Oh my

Tom Rowland: god. Kinda like you shouldn't have been waiting for those fish. I didn't know. Like, I mean, the closest thing I've got to him is a Jack Cavell. Right? He's not gonna eat you. And these things these were not big enough to eat me. But the the way he said it was just kinda like if if I had someone come to the Everglades with us and they're getting in with a crocodile, and they have no idea that, you know, that a crocodile is dangerous. And you're like, dude, that was a crocodile. Like, what are you doing? Like, you don't need to be doing that with a crocodile. They eat people. That that's kinda how he said it to me, and I was like, oh, understood. I get I guess I get it. But those fish are massive. They do get huge. And a 220 pounder, like, that is I don't even know, like, what kind of tackle are you using? Bait cast? No.

Jim Root: We're using tackle. Spin. We're using team three rods. We're using, Shimano 18 k's, 100 pound leaders. The poppers are all made by them. They're, the guide, their poppers are called Ad Heck, sport fishing. That fish almost pulled me over the rail. I said that out loud. Like, because I was not gonna let go of that rock. I I mean, I was

Tom Rowland: That's a real fish. That's that's like the the the giant Trevally. I fish for him in a number of different places, and I've never caught a a true giant. But that's on my list. I'm going to Seychelles this year and that and I'm taking spin and tackle, like heavy spin and tackle for that, not just fly fishing. Because I've gone all over the world now to try to catch these things and I I've done it mostly only with fly rods. And, you know, like, there were some pretty good sized ones that, you know, you could get a a cast to with a big plug, but you're not getting a fly to it. Yeah. Right? And and

Jim Root: What kind of fly reel?

Tom Rowland: Feels like if you're gonna go all the way or well, you just use the same kind that we use for tarpon, just giant big able reels or, you know, like a like a, Ted Jurassic, you know, Tibor Yeah. Giant reel. They have they have they have fly reel technology that is it can definitely land Yeah.

Jim Root: The ones I took over there, I took a Nautilus monster and a Nautilus silver king. Those were the two reels that

Tom Rowland: I took. Yeah. The fly reels have gotten so good. I mean, it's basically like a disc brake these days, and and they can handle so much backing. Yeah. And, you know, they're they're really, really, really good, the the fly reels. But, you know, you're just limited, so much even if you're, you know, one of the best casters in the world. You know, throwing a 100, a 110 feet that's with one of those big flies that's big enough to make one of those Travalli wanna eat it. That's, like, that's really hard. You know? And and and a 110 feet is not very far compared to how far you can throw a giant popper on a on a spinning rod. You know? You can you just your your chances of catching something go up so high. And this time, like, I'm taking it. Like, I love spin fishing.

Jim Root: I do. I mean, I

Tom Rowland: I actually kinda prefer it, honestly, the overfly. But there are these locations where you go, and The Seychelles is one where it's perfect for fly fishing. And with the exception of when you see one of these big GTs, and, you know, that's what your guide is there for. They carry this rod for me while I fish for the bonefish and everything else that's there. But, when we see a GT, I'm throwing this. Or or they also have massive massive barracudas over there, which are one of my favorite fish to catch anyway. And, they just have these. Pew I've seen pictures of these huge ones, and they're catching them on fly. But I would imagine if you had a if you had a a spinning outfit with the right lure, they're eating out every Yeah.

Jim Root: I imagine they're eating

Tom Rowland: almost a little fly that's the size that's as thin as this pencil. Like, you know, that's not very interesting for a 40 pound barracuda like this. Like, that's a tiny little thing. But they eat tiny you know, elephants eat peanuts. That's what they say. So

Jim Root: It's true.

26:00 · Why Writing the Book Was the Hardest Thing He’s Ever Done

Tom Rowland: Hey. So one of the things I was interested in, you said that writing that book was the hardest thing that you've ever done. What was so hard about writing the book? And and and you're coming from a background of being a writer. Right? Like, you're already writing. So what made what made writing that book so hard?

Jim Root: I can't remember what my word count was that I had to hit. I wanna say I'm just gonna throw out a number because I can't remember. I'm gonna say it's, like, 40,000 words. Right?

Tom Rowland: K.

Jim Root: So I was like, alright. Cool. So I wrote the first chapter, and then I was like, alright. How what's the word count on this first chapter? And it was, like, 500. And I was, like, okay. Well, can I expand on it at all? And I tried that, and I was, like, no. Because now it sucks. Like, I can't make it people aren't gonna wanna read it because it's you know? So I went back down to the original chapter. And then I was like, okay. Well, then how many chapters do I need in order to hit this limit? And it was, like, 70. And I was like

Tom Rowland: Wow.

Jim Root: What how many chapters can I come up with? So I went through, like, every technique I could think of. Right? And then I would sit, like, let's just say 18. Right? So I'm like, okay.

Tom Rowland: Yeah.

Jim Root: Now I still I would have to write 50 more chapters on top of that. I can't come up with 50. Like, what am I gonna do? And I was like, I can do some I can do some trips. I can fish with, you know, Brandon, or I could go fish this lake or go fish this lake, talk about a trip to the Saint Lawrence River, talk about fishing Oneida Lake, like Susquehanna, Delaware River, like, all these different places. And then I got to, like alright. So this is how many chapters I would need, and then I needed to actually do it. And I didn't wanna just write about, like, throwing a spinnerbait. I wanted to go fish a spinnerbait and then it come back and write about it so I could be like, this is really what we have to do. Because otherwise, if you and I'm sure you can relate to this as a fisherman and as a creator.

If you just sit down and you write about something, it's not gonna you're not gonna have all the intricacies of it as if you had just gone and done it. Like, hey. Sometimes for, like, a week. Like, some sometimes we're reeling it too fast, and it's like a split second too fast. And then how do you gauge that? How do you how do you maintain that same speed that you need with that reel and that type of line and with the current being where it is in order to get trigger those bites from those fish? And so that's why I wanted to do it all in succession. So and then and at the same time, I have at the time, I have two young kids and, four and one. So, you know, I'm a dad full time, and then I would write from, like, 11:00 at night to, like, 03:00 in the morning in my own space, quiet.

Tom Rowland: And you got another job at the same time?

Jim Root: This is all I'm doing right now.

Tom Rowland: Okay.

Jim Root: I'm just doing Alright. I'm doing some marketing stuff, like, doing some social stuff. You know? I started to figure out other little ways, like, how can I get better at using, like, InDesign or Premiere Pro or Mhmm? Photoshop. Mhmm. And it was like, well, at the at the time, I was, like, running social media for Dobbins, and I was on Gary's team. And they were like, hey. We need a product catalog. Can anyone in here do it? I was like, I can do it. And they're like, alright. Cool. I did it for just, like, two runs. It was, like, no money. But it forced me to learn how to use InDesign, and it allowed me to put myself in the catalog. So those were the two reasons why I agreed to build it. But, you know, do you like, the reason why it was so hard is because it took me, like, ten months. And all I did was

Tom Rowland: Ten months and you make $1,500. That sounds a lot like my fly tying career. I did this one time when I was a when I was a fight well, fly fishing guide in Wyoming, and I decided to spend the winter there. I'll go to the shop and I'm like, hey, would you know, if I tie some flies, would you wanna buy them? And they're like, yeah. Yeah. Sure. So I tie Quigley Cripples, and I tie, like, what I think is just a ton of them, man. I tie, like, I don't know, 30 dozen

Jim Root: dozen. Like eight months.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. And I did it all winter long. And, you know, just like just like you got some, you know, some lessons that you learn from from this and that you take away from. One of mine is never do any kind of deal without negotiating a price first. Right? Like, they're like, yeah. These are beautiful flies, but this is what we pay, and that's the same thing we pay for Sri Lankan flies or or or Chinese flies or whatever. And this is this is the price. You want it? You wanna sell them or not? I'm like, well, I guess, but I kept, like, you know, 10 dozen for myself, and I'm like I mean, I still have them. I still have some of these flies, like, that I tied, but what a what a waste of time. And so I never again tried to tie flies commercially.

Jim Root: Yeah.

Tom Rowland: And I all and I immediately understood why the best fly tires are tying, like, sailfish flies and these big marlin flies and these giant flies because they could sell them for $25 a piece. Yeah. Like, just because they're huge. But the work I put into these little size sixteen and eighteen flies were were way more.

Jim Root: Yeah.

Tom Rowland: Right? But I didn't I didn't negotiate the price, and now that what a hard lesson for a young man to to learn and not be able to pay rent. Like, Yeah. Yeah. That's I

31:57 · Losing the Weather Underground Sponsorship and Betting on Himself

Jim Root: can relate to that. I really can, man. There were some times when I left when I lost my sponsorship with Weather Underground and I decided I was just gonna try to make it as a content creator, was right after my dad passed. My dad and he was young. He was 58. And, well, I'll never forget. I was at my grandmother's house with my son, JJ, who's 14 now, but he was, like, just turned two right after my dad died. And he's sitting on my grandma's knee, and they're all talking about, like, you know, like, what the family does. So, like, I think he's gonna be adopted. I think he's gonna be a baseball player. Blah blah blah blah blah. And then it goes all around the room. It gets back to my grandmother, and she goes, he can do whatever he wants. And I listened to that, and I was like, but, Kenny?

Like, how, if that's true, how are we sending that message to him by all of us continuing to work jobs that we hate? How where who's gonna demonstrate to him that if you wanna do something, you can do it? And that's when I was like, f this, man. I'm I'm gonna show him, and I'm too smart to keep doing this job that I hate. And I'm gonna fish for a living. And my family told me that I was living this Peter Pan fantasy, and I was nuts. And they basically, like, cut me off. And I'll never forget, there was a there was a time when I had no money. And by no money, I mean, my couch cushions were already searched through, like, everything you can name. Right? There's no money anywhere in my house. Zero. I only have 2 pennies. Nothing. And I needed diapers and milk.

And I was sitting there at my kitchen table in my dad's house, right, trying to figure out if I could steal it from the dollar store in town and get away with it. And I was like, I can't I just can't do that. I just have I can't do that. I gotta go to I'll go to bed, and I'll figure it out tomorrow. Figure out something tomorrow. Woke up in the morning with an email. This is I just got a true story, man. It still makes me emotional to think about, but that email said we saw this other video you did for this other company. We want you to do that video for us. We'll pay you $10,000. We'll pay you $5 up front. We'll send it to you right now. Send us your PayPal. Send me the product. And it fucking changed my life, man. It did.

Tom Rowland: That is

Jim Root: so cool. Felt like Universe had sent to me in that moment, okay. Like, okay. You did the right thing. Don't give in. Don't quit, and it's all gonna be okay. Like, just keep going. And everything started to turn around after that. It really did. I started to get like and and doors would close. You know what I mean? Like, you sign a deal, they only pay you half of what the contract says. You do this, they only pay you half. They never pay you, whatever. But it but it would always lead to the next thing, and the next thing wouldn't have happened if that other thing didn't implode. Right. So

Tom Rowland: Right.

Jim Root: Next thing you know, like, I'm on TV and I'm hosting this show, and I'm sitting there on a in a cab bus going from the Komodo Airport to the hotel, and I'm passing all these Starbucks that are being built and these new hotels. And the driver's like, you know, we're so excited because these are gonna bring all these new jobs to this area, and we're passing these houses that have no doors and no windows, just empty holes, kids running around naked, happy as can be, don't have a nickel, nothing. Families of five, this is a true story, Families of five riding around on a moped. Reynolds Wolf from the weather channel was my guest on that show, and he was having a heart attack to see mom, dad, three kids, all hanging on like this on a moped, flying down through traffic at speed, and that was everywhere. Everywhere. Because that was all they could afford. And they're like, yeah.

They're gonna bring all these new jobs. And I'm like, no. They're not. They're not gonna hire you. They may hire you to start. But as soon as that hotel opens up and all these Americans start coming here and they see how beautiful this place is and how cheap the cost of living is, and they say I wanna move here, they're gonna hire them. Or they're gonna bring them over before they even open. And that's when I started to question, what am I doing with this show? Am I really helping it all, or am I adding to this problem that I'm looking at right now?

Tom Rowland: Right. Right.

37:05 · “My Kids Don’t Care How Successful I Am”: Walking Away From TV

Jim Root: And it really bothered me seeing and it was a weird juxtaposition because in my eyes, they have nothing, and their kids are so happy. And that's when I realized also that my kids don't care how successful I am, how much money I have. We have a pool. Whatever. All they want is my focus and my time.

Tom Rowland: That's right.

Jim Root: And no amount of money that I made would ever buy me a moment in time.

Tom Rowland: Sometimes the more money you make, the less time you have.

Jim Root: Yes. That's

Tom Rowland: And certainly sometimes that you make, the less time you have for your family even if that's the entire reason that you are out there making that kind of money is because you're trying to improve the life for your family. That is that's a very strange predicament to find yourself in of, like, what am I doing here? Like

Jim Root: And then

Tom Rowland: That's fairly Then my

Jim Root: youngest son was diagnosed with apraxia, which is a speech disorder. It's like they can't

Tom Rowland: k.

Jim Root: They talk, but it sounds like he's speaking German. Doesn't make any sense. He can't understand a word he says.

Tom Rowland: Really? And

Jim Root: he needed to go to speech therapy five days a week. And I was like, you know, this is my sign that I need to stop. I need to walk away. I need to be present. He needs someone to take in the speech. There's nobody else that can do it, and, really, it should be me that does it. So I walked away from bragging rights completely. And I, at that point in time, had resigned myself that I would not go back to TB again. I was done. Fast forward, like, two years later, Jayce is great, completely verbal. You'd never know. He reads to me on the ride home, like, from school. And and I'm having this, like, flashback moment about, like, how far he's come and how amazing it is and how grateful I am and everything else. And they can't they weren't old enough to remember when I was traveling and doing other stuff. And my oldest is like, dad, you think he'll ever, like, do TV again?

And I was like, I don't know, buddy. I don't it has to be different. And then I started to think about it more and more, and I was like, if I did come back, what would that look like? Like, what, you know, what kind of parameters, conditions? What would be important to me? And then all of that sort of came together with this opportunity to host this new show called Just Landed, where the show is rooted in sustainability. And there's, like, an opportunity with this show to tell real human stories, focus on culture, people, what is going on. You know, the last network, I kinda had this other idea to do, like, a broader travel show, and we pitched it to them. And they were like, it's a great idea, but, you know, everyone because this is subscription based at OSG, everyone really just wants to watch you fish. You can only do, like, 10% of other stuff. And I was like, no.

I wanna do more than that. I don't I don't wanna just entertain people anymore. It's still important to me, but not I I want it to be meaningful, and I wanna feel better at the end of the day about what I did. So we had this meeting, and they were like, how you know, in a perfect world, what would you do? I said, in a perfect world, I'd only fish, like, 30% of the time because there's only, like, 25,000 people in The United States who recreationally, not as work, no, just for fun, recreationally fish more than 200 days a year. But there are, like, 42,000,000 people in The United States that buy a fishing license every year. And those are the people that I wanna target. Like, those people that take vacations, and they fish, but it's not the only thing they do. They bring their families. They do other stuff. And I do want it to be, like, rooted in sustainability.

I wanna show, like, why it's important that we have, you know, quotas for tuna or why the striper migration is important and why all these states need to get on board because otherwise, you know, you don't realize how significant what happens in the Chesapeake Bay or the coast of New Jersey impacts the striper fishery in Maine. And so all these states need to really, like, get on board with each other, things like that. So to go all the way back to what you had asked me earlier, would I have done it different? No. I would not. I would have still done it all the same because it all led me to where I am, and I learned so much throughout the course of that process.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. That's super interesting. I feel, you know, I've I've had similar conversations with my with my kids about, you know, you you have you have mistakes. You you you you maybe you use bad judgment. You make a mistake, whatever. Cost you something in your past. And people have asked that, like, you know, to a similar question. I didn't even realize that I was kind of asking you that question or that it would go that deeper that you would you would perceive it that way. But it's but I've answered the question, a lot of questions the same kind of way. Is that, no, I wouldn't change anything because everything that I've done up until this point leads me to where I am today. And I love my family, and I love where I am. I love my career. And, yes, there have been definitely been things that I did not use the best judgment on.

There have definitely been things that I wish that I had done a little differently in hindsight that you wish that you had the the presence of mind to, you know, act differently or or whatever. But it all comes to where you are today. And to live a truly happy life, having no regrets is amazing. You can you know, that's and that seems like, you know, kinda where you are. Like, yeah. It probably would have been better to take the to take the full amount Yeah. You know, upfront. But, you know, I don't know. Your life would be completely different if you had done that.

Jim Root: No doubt. I believe that a 100%. And it

44:07 · The Ghostwriting Years and the Article Bob Sent Back

Tom Rowland: So when you're off of, when you're off of the, you know, the TV circuit and and you're not you're not I don't know. What were you doing when you were helping your son with with his speech?

Jim Root: Nothing really. I would I was doing some marketing work and, like, social media. I sort of shifted into this role as, like, a photojournalist. I would do a lot of, like, product stuff. So guys would send me, like, you know, like, knives or reels, and I would do, like, articles and stuff for them. But it was almost like ghostwriting. I'll tell you what's funny. I'll tell you a story, but I can't, like, full I I can only tell you, like, part of it, and you'll understand more, I think. But there was an there was a media outlet that I really, really wanted to write for, and I was trying really, really hard. And I got connected to this guy, and he we'll call him, Bob. Okay? And Bob connected me to the guy in charge when he set up a meeting. And he and Bob was like, hey. Jim really wants to write for you guys. You know? And he you know, he's not asking for anything.

He just wants, you know, to write there. And he's writing it, you know, weather channel and all sort of stuff. And the guy was like, cool. And I was like, so and he was like, yeah. Write me an article about this rod. Give me 500 words on this rod. I was like, yes. I went home. I wrote the article, and then I sent it to Bob. And Bob called me, and I was all excited. Right? Because I was like, I just knocked Bob's socks off. Bob's gonna jump on the phone, and then he's gonna tell me how great it was. And I was like, so what did you think? And he was like, I think it sucks. And I was like I was like, what? In my head, I'm like, he's gotta be, like, screwing with me. And he was like, this whole article is like, I think this, I think this, I love this Rod, this. He's like, who the f are you? You're a nobody. I don't give two shits what you think about that, Rod.

You need to go back and rewrite that article, and it needs to say, you're gonna love this, Rod, because of this. You're gonna love this, Rod, because of this. And then you can send that article back to me. And I hung up the phone, and I felt like I just been gut punched. I felt like this was this one guy in the industry who I thought was my friend, and then he was, like, basically shitting on me and all this other stuff. And then the more I thought about it, I was like, no. He's right. And that was maybe the best advice I had ever been given up until that point. And good for him for having the guts to tell me that knowing that it was probably gonna hurt. Right? So So I went back and rewrote it. I sent it. Don't hear anything back. Write another one. Send it. Don't hear anything back. Write another one. Send it. Don't hear anything back. I read them like, hey. Are you getting these?

And he's like, yeah. Yeah. I'm getting them. Just go ahead and just, like, keep them coming. And then, like, a month later, I look, and here's the article by so and so other dude. Oh, no. And I'm like, hold on. Like and then another. Here's another one by the top guy. The top guy is putting out my stuff. And he rewrote it, but it was all paraphrasing what I had said, and I was livid. And I was like, that's it. I'm done. I'm out. And I still kept writing, but I kept writing for other people. And then when that book came out and that book debuted at number one, I wrote another big article. It was a big article. And I sent it to that guy, Bob, again, and I was like, hey. Check out this article, man. I think you're gonna like it. And I and I sent it to him, and about five minutes later, he called me back. Right? And he goes I go, what'd you think?

And he goes, I think you need to go back and rewrite it. And I said, well, what do what do I need to add? And he goes, because now you're Jim fucking Root, and you need to write. I I think this, and I think that. Because now you're number one seller, Jim Root, and you need to and you need to write that in that article. And that was, like, so gratifying for me in that moment that that guy was like, you know, you did this, and you did this, but now you did this. But while I was off and, like, kinda, like, laying low, I would I just went back to ghostwriting again. I didn't want the, like, the notoriety, I guess. I just really wanted

Tom Rowland: Yeah.

Jim Root: Like, full step back. Didn't want to be tempted by, like, doing hard work again. I really wanted to be focused on my family and and, like, be present with my kids until I felt like they were in a better place for me. And if the right opportunity came along, then I would, you know, pursue that opportunity. And that's kinda where I am right now. And I'm so excited about this new show. We start filming next week in Virginia Beach. We're gonna fish for it.

Tom Rowland: Really?

Jim Root: New back?

49:29 · Just Landed: A New Show About Fishing Culture, Food, and Conservation

Tom Rowland: Are you co Coby fishing down there?

Jim Root: What are you doing? For, Bluefin, Bigeye, Marlin. And then I'm gonna go out on a commercial blue crab boat, which would be awesome. I've never done that. And then I'm gonna kayak around the Back Bay Wildlife Refuge.

Tom Rowland: Wow. So what's, what's the format of the show? Like, what what how does an episode kinda fit together?

Jim Root: So this particular episode in, Virginia Beach is gonna be, like, focused on, like, the the the fishing culture and the, like, farm to table culture in Virginia Beach. It's funny because for me, I think of farm to table as only being something that's kind of gained a lot of momentum in, like, the last three or four years. But there's an area in Virginia Beach called The Congo where they basically started with these farm to, like, market places in the in the seventies. So if they weren't the, like, pioneers of it on a broader scale, they certainly were at least in Virginia, this was the birthplace of farm to table. And so Yeah. I'm gonna go there. There's some really great restaurants, breweries.

I'm excited to see this other side of Virginia Beach because I've definitely been there, but I've only been to, like, strip, done the commercial stuff that, like, everyone usually does when they go to Virginia. But, like, that wildlife refuge, I didn't know they had wild horses in there. And I don't mean, like, the Chikatik ponies, which are cool. I've seen them. I mean, these are, like, you know, these are horses. Like, real Yeah. Full grown. And so I'm I'm just really excited to do something that when it's done and it's produced and it's put out there, I can I'll feel really good about what I did. And I'll feel like I can say I tried to do my part to make sure that, like, my kids can fish too when they're old. My grandkids can fish too. Not saying that, you know, I'm gonna have that big of an impact, but at least I made an effort. You know?

Tom Rowland: Right. How are you gonna balance the, you know, the travel and the the time on the the TV?

Jim Root: So Shavu. The other thing that was really important to me was what kind of time commitment I'd be looking at. And, if we you know, I signed up to do eight episodes. And, I think the most I would be willing to do in a year is, like, sixteen. It's, three days of filming, so I'd be gone five days total. And that'd keep me under a hundred days. If I can do that, then I can still, like, not miss soccer games, not miss swim meets, you know Yeah. Stuff like that that

52:44 · “Two Summers Left”: Watching Kids Grow Up Too Fast

Tom Rowland: That's that's super important. Especially the kid at the age your kids are. My kids are grown now for the most part. I've got a 27, a 25, and a 21.

Jim Root: God bless.

Tom Rowland: But those those times, man, it it's really amazing because I've got a lot of friends now that are much younger than me, and they're having they're having kids, and they're they're they're much younger. They're three, five, seven, you know. And some of these guys ask, you know, like, what to expect or anything or or I don't know. Somebody might be just saying, well, we're not getting any sleep right now. I'm like, look. It's gonna be over. There's gonna be there's light at the end of the tunnel. I promise you. Like, it seems like this is never gonna end, but it's going to end. And then when it does, there is a period of time where where it's like I don't know if it was like this for you, but I mean, from when they're born to about five, it moved fast, but nowhere nearly as fast as, say, '17 to 20 '1. Like, that time blew by. I mean, one minute, they're getting their driver's license.

The next minute, they're graduating from college. It went by so fast. And it's like in the early time, we were busier with smaller things, and and there were so many things that, like, you know, it's just like a billion things coming at you. But then as they get older, it's soccer games, it's wrestling matches, it's lacrosse tours, it's all of these different things. And and you just get started on these things, and the next thing you know, it's like, how are you graduating college right now? Like, how? That is it went by so fast.

Jim Root: Yeah. I'm not there yet.

Tom Rowland: And I'm I'm sure I can't hear. Well, this is what old old people used to tell me this all the time. Like, the older you get, the faster time goes. And maybe that's what it is. Maybe that's what it is, but it just does seem like there are certain periods in that in their life that time just blows by.

Jim Root: It does.

Tom Rowland: But how old are your kids?

Jim Root: They're so they're 14, 11, eight. And then I got married, a year almost two years ago, and we have a son now who's almost 11. And it's her birth it's her first. And so

Tom Rowland: Okay.

Jim Root: I'll tell her like, it's funny because before we had him, right, like, my my daughter usually is the one who would, like, wake up in the middle of the night. She's the 11 year old. But, you know, a couple years ago when she was, like, eight or nine, she'd wake up in the middle of the night. She'd be like, I just had a bad dream. Can I sleep with you? And I'm like, of course. And her and then, you know, my wife and my mother-in-law were like, you can't let them do that because once they start, they never stop. And I was like, oh, no. They stop. And then you're like, dang. Don't you wanna, like, have a bad dream and come, like, you know, snow again like you used to, like, when you were little and you actually wanted to be around me and, like, they don't. That happens, like, this small, and then it's gone, and then they're too old for that. And then Yeah. I know. I'll never forget.

Last summer, my wife was like, we should get them you know, we should send them to, like, summer camp and stuff. And I was like, not a chance in hell. Like, JJ is 14. I got two summers left where he actually wants to spend time with me. Like, I'm there's no way I'm gonna send him away for a month, like, not happening. Once he's 16 and he's driving, he's gone. Like and then we'll be gone. Like, right now, this is the time when I want them here, like, more than ever. And, that's what we had. Jules, Julian, I was just like, now I see it. Like, I see what you're talking about. Because he went from being this teeny tiny little thing to, like, now he's starting to walk. And she's like, no. I don't want him to walk yet. And I'm like, oh, yeah. It's over. Like, I told you. It just but it's funny you mentioned that there's periods where it flies for me.

It's you know, when COVID when we were on lockdown here in New York, my son, JJ was 10. And I have videos of him. Right? And he still had these chubby cheeks, and he still kinda had the squeaky voice. And just like that, he's Mhmm. He's a man. Like, he's got this little dirty gringo mustache, and, like, he's you know what I mean? He's 14. And, like, his voice is deeper, and he's five ten. And, you know, I'm still taller than him. Thank god. He's been taller than his mother for, like, two years. I can't imagine. But, at least I still got him for a little while. But it's just like you were still a baby just four years ago, and now like that Yeah. The difference is just insane how fast it happens. And I'm you know, this is that period now. I'm in that period with my daughter.

She's gonna go from, like, 10 to 13 or 10 to 14 where she's gonna change to and it's like, sometimes I really do wish that I could just freeze time, slow down. Like, you know?

Tom Rowland: Yeah. You do. But going back to our our original conversation about regrets and changing things, and if you froze time, it would make things different.

58:34 · If You Could Relive One Moment of Your Life

Jim Root: Ask you a question, Tom.

Tom Rowland: And yeah. If

Jim Root: you could not redo it. Right? But if you could just relive a moment of your life, what would it be?

Tom Rowland: Those are those are, I don't know that I have a singular moment, but the birth of all my kids is definitely one. My wedding day is definitely one that I probably wasn't as present. I'd you know, when you're young and you're doing something like that, some people are mature enough and present enough to be like, this is a moment. This is one of the most important moments in my life. I just was like, whoo. We're getting married. This is awesome. You know? So I would like to I would like to relive that. That would be something. But, you know, those those are the type of moments, you know, I when you ask that, I don't think of a single fish that well, I mean, there then once you start thinking about it is like, well, the first time we ever caught a giant hammerhead, that was pretty awesome. And the adrenaline was, like, so like, first permit on fly.

The adrenaline you're just pumping with adrenaline. It's amazing. But, you know, you can do that over again. You only I only have three kids. I only get married once. And and those things are those things are really important. And those whole that whole day, I mean, my parents were were there for the birth of all three of my children. So that was amazing, you know, to share that experience. And I would I would think it would be something like that. But nobody's, nobody's ever asked me that question before. And I don't know that I don't know that I've ever really thought about it, like, longing to relive a moment as much as I look forward to the next moments. You know?

And I try I try, you know, to to not live too much in the past and not live too much in the future and try as much as possible to live in the present right now because that's the only thing that you can you you know, I mean, that's what we have. And if you and I like it that, you know, optimists tend to live in the future. A lot of pessimists tend to live in the past, but I think that e if you're living in one of those other places, like thinking about how great it's gonna be if or I wish I had done this, you're not grounded Yeah.

Jim Root: In that respect.

Tom Rowland: You know?

Jim Root: I used to be like that. I used to be I was always thinking about the next place, especially when I was doing the show. Soon as I would be there halfway through that trip, my mind would already be on where I was going next, where I was going next until Volley. Volley, when I got on that plane and I headed home, and we were it was actually the puddle jumper from Komodo back to Volley. The whole plane ride was silent. Everyone were crying nonstop. The whole time we were on the plane, everyone was crying. And I can't speak for those guys, but I will tell you for me, it was a lot of things. But mainly, it was that I knew that I

Tom Rowland: Oh, no. His recording stopped.

Jim Root: Yeah. Let's see. He has some call coming in.

Tom Rowland: Oh, okay. So I think I think you just had a call come in. But you said just do that again because you got it right. You said because I knew

Jim Root: Because I I I knew that I would go back there, but it would not be with those guys.

Tom Rowland: Yes.

Jim Root: And that there's not enough time really in the show for us to get into all of that. But, and I didn't wanna think forward anymore. I wanted to I needed to be grounded and start focusing on, like, what am I doing? What do I, like, what do I want? What am I chasing right now or running from? You know? Mhmm. And I needed to, like, really start asking those harder questions of myself. And the reason why I asked you that is, because I asked that question to people periodically that like to hunt and fish, and it would probably surprise you or maybe it wouldn't. They all answered almost the same way. None of them very few, maybe one out of a 100 will say, I would go back and shoot this deer again, or I would go catch this fish again. And they're all like, I would go have a conversation with my dad, or I would, like, go back to the birth of my kids. We go back to my wedding day.

Like, all of them are are more personal, like, life defining moments, not Right. These, you know, fish that we caught or deer or anything like that. No matter how emotional it was at the time, Those never tend to be the the things that people say I would do again.

1:04:27 · Presence, Tree Stands, and the Cast You Can’t Repeat

Tom Rowland: So Right. I appreciate Yeah. That's interesting. But when you're out there, when you're talking to people that tend to like to like to hunt and fish and spend time outdoors, hike, you know, what whatever whatever it is. I mean, if you're if you're spending your time hunting, you're outdoors. If you're spending your time fishing, you're outdoors. If you're spending your time hiking or rock climbing or something that gets you outside into the natural world. You're unplugged from your phone. You are present. And in those times, I know that I start to think about what's really important in your life. Like, yes. I enjoy this, and this is really great, but this is also a place that I appreciate the rest of my life. Like, the things that are truly, truly, truly important to me, my my wife, my children, my family.

And and I think that's probably the case with a lot of people because, you know, hunters, fishermen, outdoors people that are getting outside regularly and are spending quiet time, you know I mean, I don't know. There's other countries that call it, like, rewilding or something like that. It's like, dude, you're just going outside like we all should be doing and spending time in the woods or in on the ocean or some wild place. And when you're doing that, I think that that you tend to maybe appreciate the rest of your life a little bit more rather than constantly being in front of a screen or plugged in or so busy with little things that that you're you're not present at all, like what we're talking about. You're not you're not in the present at all.

You are sending an email for the future or you're trying to fix something that happened in the past or you're you're you're just being reactive to all these things that come in, all all the whatever problems in whatever line of work you have, you're just dealing with that stuff. Whereas if you get away from it, now you start to realize what's really important. At least me.

Jim Root: Yeah. I

Tom Rowland: mean, I have to have that time.

Jim Root: I think I get more introspective like that in a in a tree stand. Like, that is more, like, zen zen like for me. I only archery hunt. I don't gun hunt. I don't have anything against gun hunting, though. For the record, I just prefer archery. When I'm on the water it's weird, though, because, like, I crave both, but they they serve me differently. Like, when I'm on the water if I'm away from the water for too long, I get weird. Like, I get my soul just doesn't feel right. And I and I but when I'm on the water or when I'm fishing, I I don't relax. I'm like I get really dialed in. And it's weird. You may I I wonder if you can relate to this at all. This happened on the last show, like, four times. We'd be on camera, and I'd be talking, and I would just stop and look, like, either look down and look at my rod, and they'd be like, what's going on?

And I'm like, I might get bit any second, and then, bang, the rod would go off just like that.

Tom Rowland: Sure.

Jim Root: Like, I would just know. That's happened to me so many times in my life. I couldn't even tell you how many. That does not happen to me in a tree stand, unfortunately. I'm never like, oh, you know what? I think this, like, 12 points gonna come walking out right now. Or if I do happen to think that, it never happens. But,

Tom Rowland: Yeah. It does happen fishing. Yeah. And then you think about it, and you're like, what was it that I noticed? And, you you know, most of the time, you can't come up with anything. Like, I don't know.

Jim Root: It didn't seem I'm gonna

Tom Rowland: try to set myself up. I'm gonna try to set myself up in the same position, the boat in the same angle, the sun at the same angle. I'm gonna cast the same way. I'm gonna do the same thing, and I'm gonna stop, and I'm not getting a bite. Like, it doesn't happen again. But for some reason, you knew, and it could be, you know, you felt something that wasn't that, you know, you could've felt something. The fish could've, you know I remember I remember a bass fisherman on TV, was talking about, he was fishing with a, you know, like a not a swim bait, but like a like a rattle trap type bait, you know, that's going. And he was saying that that when the fish came up and he said, just a second. He'll be right back, I think. I don't know what happened.

Jim Root: Oh, so what happened was, can you hear me?

Tom Rowland: Yeah. Gotcha.

Jim Root: My wife just pulled in and my audio switched to the truck.

Tom Rowland: Oh, and I've done that's that's mine too. So, anyway, with, like, a rattle trap type bait, this this professional bass fisherman was talking about how he knew that a fish almost ate it because as the fish came up to it and then didn't eat it, it pushed the bait forward slightly. So there was tiny little tiny tiny bit of slack in the line to where, I guess, if you're using braided line, and you can actually feel that. Like, the bait did a weird thing. So he knows on the next one, he's probably gonna bite it this time. Right? I'm gonna cast to the same place and come through. There's probably things that are are so small and imperceptible like that that, you know, a professional fisherman, somebody like yourself, that was myself fishes a lot, has fished their entire life.

It's such a small imperceptible thing that you don't even realize it yourself, but it got your attention and you're like, you're you're about to get bit. Like, who knows what it is? Yeah. I don't know. But, yeah, it's definitely happened. It's a that's a that's a weird thing, but you're kind of in the zone. You know, you're like, you're in the zone. Yeah. That's that's in flow state, you know, with with fishing. And then there's other times where you throw it up again. You're like, it's going under that bush, and I'm getting bit. And you throw this thing, and you're like, dang. Were the cameras rolling? Did anybody see that? Because that was, like, the best cast I've ever made, and I got bit at the same time. And I called it before that, and everybody's eating a sandwich, and they don't see it. Yeah. That's how it usually

Jim Root: it's how it usually happens.

Tom Rowland: I'm like,

Jim Root: can you do that again? Swear. They're like, can you do that again? I'm like, oh,

Tom Rowland: yeah. I

Jim Root: do not.

Tom Rowland: Sure. I can. And the next one's in the bush and you're pulling on it and breaking it off. Yeah. That happens to me too. Or hey.

Jim Root: Just let me I'm just finished. Tell him when he just we can't get it. Take a second. Hey. You don't mind, man. Like, just swim back out there and eat it again.

1:11:10 · When Just Landed Airs — and an Ice Fishing Invitation

Tom Rowland: Yeah. That would be nice. Hey. So do you have any idea when this show's gonna be finished? When it's gonna be on the air? Where can people see it?

Jim Root: I hope. December, but probably January. It'll be on Amazon Prime and YouTube. It's called Just Landed, and stay tuned. If you, you know, wanna check me out on Instagram, I'll let you know Yeah. What is that? When it's out. My Instagram is the at Jim Root Fishing.

Tom Rowland: Okay. Very cool. Yeah.

Jim Root: We should do something together on the

Tom Rowland: show, Absolutely, man. That'd be fantastic. Bring it on. I'm ready. Yeah. I love it. Especially if it's something I've never done before, which is, that's my favorite type of fishing right now. Anything that I haven't done before. It's pretty awesome, except I'm not so crazy about ice fishing. Although, I gotta say, I've never tried it. So I don't know.

Jim Root: I don't like being out thin ice. That makes me real, real nervous. But Yeah.

Tom Rowland: I would imagine so.

Jim Root: But I would do I would go to, like, Minnesota where, you know, you've got, like, two feet of ice, and you're in these, like you ever seen those fish houses that they have

Tom Rowland: out there? Yes. With the

Jim Root: big screen TVs in them that are this big, and they're heated? Like, let's go do that. Let's go sit there. I mean, that to me is, like, yeah. Otherwise, fishing. Like, I can sit in a T shirt and shorts and have coffee and, yeah, I mean, that sounds like happy.

Tom Rowland: That would be that would be fun. But, yeah, I'd do I'd love to do something with you. That'd be fun, man. I've I've really enjoyed this getting to know you, and and you got some great stories. And and certainly looking forward to seeing this show and, wish you the the very best with it. That was that was a great conversation, man.

Jim Root: Yeah. It was great being here and I look forward to talking to you again soon.

1:13:03 · Hot Seat: Steelhead, Luwak Coffee, and the Worst Cup in America

Tom Rowland: Okay. We're gonna finish this up with the the hot seat questions. So these are either or questions. You just do these questions as quickly as you as you can. Not don't you don't have to put a lot of thought into it. Are you ready?

Jim Root: One second. I gotta let my dog off. She's gonna go

Tom Rowland: to the Okay.

Jim Root: I'll be right back.

Tom Rowland: That's obviously more important.

Jim Root: She's only, only five and a half months.

Tom Rowland: Oh, really? Yes. You definitely need to let her out. I'm a dog person, so I get it. Okay. The most underrated fish you've caught while traveling.

Jim Root: Man, underrated by who? I would say, steelhead.

Tom Rowland: Steelhead. Okay. Have you ever gotten sick on one of these trips?

Jim Root: Oh my god. Awful. My whole life, I wanted to go to Montana and go fly fishing. I finally got the opportunity to go to Bozeman. I was in the Gallatin Gateway. I was so stoked. Went to bed. Woke up at 03:00 in the morning with a fever puking my brains out. I was there to do a photo shoot with a sunglasses company. I was I had to sleep, like, sixteen hours a day. They would wake me up for an hour, drive me down into the creek. I would stand there for, like, ten minutes until I felt like I was gonna faint again, and then they would take me back. I would sleep again. Then I didn't I didn't catch fish. It was awful. And by the way, I haven't been back yet. So Well,

Tom Rowland: that's where we can go. My my boys both went to Montana State, and, we spend a lot of time in Bozeman. Alright. Sunrise or sunset?

Jim Root: Sunrise.

Tom Rowland: One place you have not been, but you would like to go.

Jim Root: To fish or to just visit?

Tom Rowland: Just to go.

Jim Root: Small deeps.

Tom Rowland: Good choice. The most difficult fish to catch on all of your travels and the technique.

Jim Root: So, again, back to the so that would either be the GT that I caught on a popper or steelhead fishing, on a center pin. Mhmm. Because you're freezing your butt off. That is the coldest I've ever been.

Tom Rowland: Steel heading?

Jim Root: Yes. Awful.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. Something you're interested in that most people would not know about.

Jim Root: I love to cook.

Tom Rowland: Love to cook. Okay. Great. Favorite fish to eat, and how would you prepare it?

Jim Root: Fun fact about me. I don't as a general rule, I don't eat seafood. However, my my wife just started laughing. She tells people all the time I married the only fisherman that doesn't eat seafood. But that comes with some caveats. Right? So, like and when we go to The Caribbean, I'll eat spiny lobster a lot. I love calamari as long as it's not doesn't taste like a rubber band. Uh-huh. But as far as, like, is there, just a fish? The best fish I ever ate was mahi, and I ate that while filming, and then they were, like, cut. And I kept eating it, and my wife was like, honey. They cut the scene. I said, I know I don't care. It's delicious. Like, I can't stop eating it, and I just kept eating it. That's the best, and it was fresh. I caught that fish that day. That's the best. It was grilled. It was so good.

Tom Rowland: The only way to make that better is to fry it, and I'm not supposed to eat fried food because, you know, it's not good for you, but there's nothing better than fried mahi. Can you have a productive trip without catching a fish?

Jim Root: No. I can't. I I can't. No. I hate fishing. I love catching. If I'm not catching them, I'm I'm usually not happy. I get my buddy used to say my pigtails would come out. I get I get real grumpy about well, the thing is, like, when you get when you spend a lot of time on the water and you become a good fisherman, you it's like an expectation that you're gonna catch. And so when you're not when you don't catch them, personally, I feel like I failed. Okay? Like, I I'm not I'm not doing my part. There's something I'm doing wrong, and I get it. Now if I'm on a if I'm on a guided trip and we're trolling, that's not me. And, like, whatever we didn't catch him, we didn't catch him. But other than that, no. It was not productive.

Tom Rowland: Okay. One destination you like to visit that does not include fishing. Maybe that's The Maldives.

Jim Root: No. I think Northern Italy, the food is incredible. I wouldn't care if I fish in there at all. I would be fine. Pretty much same as Caribbean. We have a great time down there. It's like my I feel kinda like Kenny Chesney in that way. Like, I just wanna be barefoot every day with my feet in the sand. I don't need to fish while we're down there.

Tom Rowland: Three places in your experience avid anglers should fish before they die.

Jim Root: Number one, Venice, Louisiana, 100%. And have a true crawfish boil when you're done. Red fishing down there is insanely good. Food is outstanding. 10 out of 10, I recommend. Two, Bali. Go fish for GTs with Reza. The best best advice I got about that was from, Brooks Robinson at Cortland Line. He said hooking a GT is the best thirty second bull ride of your life. You got thirty seconds to convince to break that fish's will and convince that it can't get away. If you can't do it in thirty seconds, you'll never land that fish. It's a true statement. And then last would probably be giant bluefin fishing off of the cape off of Cape Cod.

Tom Rowland: Good choices. Text or call? I

Jim Root: would say text, but I'm awful at like, just I like cold call FaceTime people all the time. My wife tells me I'm nuts for doing that. But I'm like, whatever. I'm just gonna FaceTime them. They answered. They're not gonna answer. So it's fun.

Tom Rowland: Okay. Text, call, or FaceTime. So this is these are the last two questions. What location have you visited that had the best coffee?

Jim Root: Oh, man. I love coffee too.

Tom Rowland: Me too.

Jim Root: I almost said something else, and then and I just got myself. San San Giovanni Bianco, San Pellegrino, Northern Italy. That's where I got hooked on espresso and, like, real coffee. Kinda like now ever since, I only drink Americanos. Really

Tom Rowland: Nice.

Jim Root: Really changed my my life. The other thing I will say is when I went to Indonesia, I drank the luwak coffee. You know what that is? Uh-uh. The luwak is like a giant weasel. They're like forty forty Oh,

Tom Rowland: it's like poop. It's the poop. Yep. I've heard about that with with not a not a weasel, but a cat

Jim Root: of Yeah. So that's what they are. But and I've had them I saw them. But they they look more like giant ferrets. They have long hair. It's very soft.

Tom Rowland: Okay.

Jim Root: They eat these berries. They can't digest the pit of them, so they poop them out, and then they roast them, grind it, brew it. That's an incredible cup of coffee.

Tom Rowland: They must poop a lot to have enough coffee to supply an entire country.

Jim Root: It's pretty wild. I was joking when when I was drinking it, and I was like, I all I could think about was whoever thought to do this. Right? Like, this was a success, I guess, on some level. But think about all these failures. Like like, what about the other stuff that this guy was like Yeah. I think we should try this, and then it didn't work out. Like Right. Because that's pretty brave. Like, I think I'm gonna roast the poop of this animal and then grind it and drink it.

Tom Rowland: Well, it starts out that you don't roast all of the poop. You pick a pick the berries out. Right? Like, that's that's probably the first mistake. Because it's really not that good. And then just the berries. We're gonna crunch we're gonna we're gonna crunch those up, and then no. That's really not that good either. We're gonna need to we're gonna need to put some fire under this.

Jim Root: Yeah.

Tom Rowland: Alright. So the last one is where is the worst coffee?

Jim Root: Oh, I mean, the worst coffee. I'd say pretty much any two star hotel lobby. But if I had to pick a if if I had to pick a I'm just gonna say it. I think Dunkin' Donuts is the worst coffee in the world. And I don't I'm probably gonna get a lot of hate from that, but I I can't.

Tom Rowland: I don't know. I don't like the I don't I I don't like drinking coffee out of a Styrofoam cup. Shame. All I've

Jim Root: been preached. That's one thing that,

Tom Rowland: that Dunkin' Donuts does. They do it in a Styrofoam cup, but I I'm not a big Starbucks fan either because I drink my coffee black.

Jim Root: Me too.

Tom Rowland: And Starbucks coffee black doesn't really taste good. And my theory on that is that they want it to be real strong and kind of burnt flavored so that when you put all this other stuff in it, it still has kind of a coffee flavor. So when you just get it black, it's really not that good. I don't I don't like it. I don't think it's good.

Jim Root: Yeah.

Tom Rowland: But I do I do like coffee. Alright. Well, that's cool, man. Jim, this was, this was great. I really enjoyed getting to know you, and let's let's definitely go fishing, man. That'll be great.

Jim Root: I'm looking forward to it.

Tom Rowland: Okay. Sounds good. And we'll get you everything when this comes out, and, look for his show, Amazon, YouTube, called Just Landed. Jim Root. Check him out. Jim Root on Instagram. And, hopefully hopefully, it'll be out in December. We can all check it out. Alright. Good to see you. Thanks.