Episode 302 of the Tom Rowland Podcast is my conversation with Dr. Patrick Rice, a shark researcher who has done extensive work on sharks and shark repellent technology, and Capt. Mike Puller, a second-generation Miami charter captain who runs the Wire to Water kids fishing camp. We dig into the science of shark repellent and its surprising World War II origins, the fishing camp Mike has built over seventeen summers, and, because Dr. Rice also works in infectious disease, how we can protect ourselves from COVID-19.
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Dr. Patrick Rice is a marine scientist who has done a tremendous amount of research on sharks and shark repellent technology, and who also has experience in infectious disease. Capt. Mike Puller is a second-generation charter fisherman out of Miami who grew up on the docks and now runs the Wire to Water kids fishing camp. The two joined Tom together for a wide-ranging conversation.
According to Dr. Rice, the concept came from fishermen themselves. Anglers long noticed that killing a shark and hanging it off the boat, or dumping shark carcasses and entrails away from the fishing grounds, would drive other sharks off. Researchers traced a chemical signal from rotting and dead sharks and worked to isolate it into a repellent that takes advantage of sharks avoiding their own dead.
Dr. Rice points to declassified U.S. Navy documents from World War II showing the Navy was already trying to develop a shark repellent. The urgency was driven by disasters like the sinking of the USS Indianapolis, the event referenced in the famous Quint monologue in Jaws, when more than a thousand sailors went into the water.
Wire to Water is a kids fishing camp Capt. Mike Puller started back in 2004 as a way to fill the slower summer months, and it has grown into something much bigger. It now runs about ten weeks of camp during the school break with multiple boats going, teaching kids to fish over an extended summer program.
Because Dr. Patrick Rice has a background in infectious disease, the conversation moves toward COVID-19 near the end. He shares his perspective on the virus and on practical ways people can protect themselves, which made for a timely and interesting close to a wide-ranging episode.
Tom Rowland Podcast Episode 302 with Capt. Mike Puller and Dr. Patrick Rice is available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and wherever you get your podcasts. Use the listen links on this page to start the episode.
I love a conversation that starts in one place and ends somewhere I never expected. Mike Puller is a second-generation Miami charter captain who has spent his life on the water and built a kids fishing camp out of the slow summer months. Patrick Rice is a scientist who has gone deep on sharks and shark repellent, and it turns out he also knows a lot about infectious disease. Putting the three of us together meant we could chase the science, the fishing, and the bigger picture all in one sitting. I wanted that range on tape.
Use the listen links above to hear the whole conversation.
Patrick explains that the concept came from fishermen, not a lab. Anglers noticed for generations that a dead shark hung off the boat, or carcasses dumped away from the grounds, would push other sharks out of the area. He walks through how researchers chased that signal from the rotting carcass to a usable repellent. Listen to how he traces it.
Patrick dug into declassified Navy documents from World War II and found the Navy was already working on a repellent, urgency driven by disasters like the USS Indianapolis, the very event Quint describes in Jaws when more than a thousand men went into the water. It is a fascinating piece of history. Hear it in the episode.
Mike started Wire to Water in 2004 just to fill the slower summer months, and it grew into a ten-week, multi-boat program. He talks about why teaching kids to fish became one of the most rewarding parts of his career. Use the listen links on this page to hear how he built it.
Because Patrick also works in infectious disease, we ended up talking about COVID-19 and how people can protect themselves. It is not where I expected a shark conversation to go, but it is one of the most useful stretches of the episode. Listen to that section.
Listen to the full conversation: Apple Podcasts · Spotify · or use the listen links above.
This is the kind of episode that reminds me why I love long-form conversations. We covered shark biology, a piece of forgotten WWII history, a kids fishing camp, and a public-health discussion, and it all flowed naturally.
Mike and Patrick both bring decades of real expertise, and the curiosity between them is contagious. Listen to the whole thing and follow the thread wherever it goes.
The Tom Rowland Podcast brings you long-form conversations with the most accomplished anglers, hunters, conservationists, and outdoor professionals in the game. Listen to every full-length Tom Rowland Podcast interview.
Capt. Mike Puller is a second-generation charter fisherman based in Miami who grew up on the docks and built the Wire to Water kids fishing camp, now in its seventeenth summer. Dr. Patrick Rice is a marine scientist who has conducted extensive research on sharks and shark repellent technology and also brings expertise in infectious disease. Together they offer a rare mix of on-the-water experience and hard science.
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