Derek DeYoung - Becoming the Top Artist in the Fishing World

Full transcript of the Tom Rowland Podcast, Episode 13 with Derek DeYoung.

Introducing Derek DeYoung

Tom Rowland: I'm Tom Rowland, and this is the Tom Rowland podcast. Hey, everybody. Welcome to the podcast today. I've got a great guest, Derek DeYoung. He's a renowned artist in the marine community, and his stuff's everywhere. Everything from trout to saltwater to some abstract stuff. He is on fire. And really, I see him as being the top artist in the marine industry right now. Anyway, I like his stuff. And guess what? He came down to film an episode of Saltwater Experience with us, and he's super cool, like really super cool.

Tom Rowland: And he's not just an artist. He's a fisherman. He's down in Big Pine living right now. He's got his own huge redfish area right out his back door. He goes out there. I guess he fishes with some friends occasionally, but he loves to fish by himself. And I know what it's like to fish in the Florida Keys by yourself. It's really super hard. Super hard to learn the water and super hard to not run aground, and it can be very frustrating. So I have really high respect for anybody that's willing to give that a try on their own because I know how difficult that can be. And that's Derek. But we're gonna talk to Derek here in just a minute.

Tom Rowland: I wanna give you a little bit of news. We are still getting a lot of ratings and reviews on iTunes, and I really thank you for that. Some of you have said some incredibly nice things, and I appreciate it. And some of you are enjoying these podcasts and these interviews way more than I thought you would. So thank you, and I'm so glad to hear that you're enjoying them. If you could just take a second, go to iTunes, and drop a rating and a review. It's gonna really help. It'll also help if you share this on social media. Just grab the link, drop it into your Facebook page, your Twitter feed, or your Instagram. If you like the episode, that would be amazing. Tell somebody about it, and we will be able to offer more and more of these.

Tom Rowland: So I hope you're enjoying the guests. If you are, I'd love to hear it on the iTunes reviews. If you have other guests, send me an email, podcast at Saltwater Experience, and I'll read that. And I'll do my best to track that guy down, girl down, someone who is interesting in the fishing, hunting, outdoor world, or as you've seen with somebody like Tim Crockett, the guy rowing across the ocean in a 20 foot boat. I thought that one was pretty cool. Some other people have really enjoyed that one. So I don't know. It doesn't have to be fishing, but it helps if it's in the outdoor space. So send me your suggestions, and we'll see what we can do.

Tom Rowland: Also, we have a new website, saltwaterexperience.com. That is the hub of everything that we're doing right now, and you can find out all the new stuff that's out there, whether it's a podcast, a weekly show, a new television show, a new episode on Waypoint, a new article, new photos, whatever it is. Whatever we got new, it's on saltwaterexperience.com, and right now, we've changed the format, and it's really easy to find all our new stuff. So go there, check it out, and let me know what you think.

Driving to Big Pine

Tom Rowland: Alright. Derek DeYoung. We went down, we had late tides. Rich really liked the tides in the afternoon, so we chose to go fishing from 2:00 until past dark. So we chose to use the morning to drive down to Big Pine and get our interview with Derek DeYoung. He's got a makeshift studio underneath his house in Big Pine. He pretty much goes fishing every day, paints in the afternoons outside. He's an outside person. He loves being outside, and we got to see him do some really cool stuff. He did this acrylic pour, ended up giving it to me, which was very nice of him, and I just thought it was a super cool piece of artwork.

Tom Rowland: But Derek has all kinds of stuff going on, and I had lots of questions for him because I just see his stuff everywhere. I wanna know how it happened because he kinda burst on the scene for me. I know he's been doing this for a long time, but like so many people, it seems like an overnight success twenty years in the making. I wanted to find out how it was going. So we fished all day. Had kind of a tough day, actually, but Derek took it in stride because this guy is a fisherman. He really fishes, and he really knows what's up. He spent nine years in Montana, and he spent six years in the Florida Keys, and he's going back up to Northern Michigan. Guess what he's gonna do up there? He's gonna fish pretty much every day.

Tom Rowland: So I figure anybody that spends that much time out in Montana and that much time in the Florida Keys is probably gonna turn into a fast friend, and I was right. Really like Derek. And I think you're really gonna like him too. I have a lot of questions for him, and it's my pleasure to introduce you to an incredible artist and an incredible dude, Derek DeYoung.

Marketing Yourself as an Artist

Tom Rowland: Okay. So we're live. Hi, Derek.

Derek DeYoung: Hey. What's going on, Tom?

Tom Rowland: I'm doing great. So if you're with us right now, I've got my new friend, Derek DeYoung, artist extraordinaire. We have just finished up an extraordinary shoot, an extraordinarily difficult shoot in Florida.

Derek DeYoung: We really did. We worked really hard.

Tom Rowland: And the reason that I wanted to have Derek both on Saltwater Experience and on the podcast is because I've admired your art. I think that not only have you done a really remarkably good job of what you do and your style, your painting and stuff, but you're also doing an incredibly good job of selling it and marketing it. And like we were talking about earlier, my son is an aspiring artist of many different types. Maybe it's video. Maybe it's studio art, kinda something like what you've got going on. But I'm trying to encourage that, and I'm trying to explain to him that, you know, knowing how to market yourself is probably as important in a lot of ways as being a great artist. So how have you done that?

Derek DeYoung: I mean, I wish there was just a simple equation I could tell you and have you pass it on to him, but it's just putting yourself out there, you know, every day, and then just following your heart as far as your work's concerned, and that's really what's so rewarding. I think that at the end of the day, people see that your heart is in it, and you love what you're doing, and that kinda gets them interested. But, you know, you gotta get out there. I went to as many art shows as I could my first couple years after I started my business. You know, it's tough. There was really not a living to be made. I don't know how these summer art fair artists make it because that is a lot of work, and there's not very much money in it.

Tom Rowland: Are they trying to make it, or are they following a passion, or are they just kinda hoping? Well, you know, it's our passion, but we still gotta pay a mortgage.

Derek DeYoung: Yeah. And try to have a normal life as much as possible. So for me, I realized pretty quickly this wasn't the path to success. I needed to switch this up.

Tom Rowland: When you say this, you mean, like, the summer art fairs?

Derek DeYoung: Yep. Just doing juried art fairs and things like that. It was a great time in my life. The first two years after art school, that's what we did, traveled around the state of Michigan during the summer, set up a 10 by 10 booth, put all my paintings up, and it was so fun and interactive to chat with people about my artwork. I mean, there's nothing better as an artist to be able to sit and talk to people about your work because you've got so much of yourself invested in each painting. So much thought has gone into it. I mean, not to be overly deep about it, but, you know, that's part of you on that canvas. So it is really rewarding to be at shows and talking to people about your work. But I figured out quickly I needed to do something more and push it in a different direction. And that's when I started to realize that there's probably a good possibility that I could get a little more commercial with my work.

Tom Rowland: And had you seen examples of that? Or you just kind of...

Derek DeYoung: You know, I just had faith that my more graphic, contemporary look to my art would work well on products. I didn't know how to get in touch with the right companies, but I can remember sitting and talking to Janelle and saying, someday, my stuff's gonna be all over the place. How to do that? I don't know. So just kinda kept pushing forward.

Moving West to Montana

Tom Rowland: What was the first time that that kind of came true for you and you saw that work into reality?

Derek DeYoung: Well, at a certain point, we decided we needed to move out west. I went and did a series of art shows out west, actually. This was such a cool trip. My father-in-law sold me a minivan for $1.

Tom Rowland: Oh, this sounds great.

Derek DeYoung: And I packed it full of fishing, camping, and art gear. And I headed from Michigan to Colorado. My brother, Matt, rode out with me and flew home from Denver. We spent a long weekend in Rocky Mountain National Park. And then I went around. I'd scheduled doing these one-man art shows at different lodges and fly shops in, like, kind of big fly fish towns.

Tom Rowland: But you had all that scheduled before you went?

Derek DeYoung: Yeah. I just looked online, fly shop, Colorado. George Anderson. Do you mind if I drop in with all my art? Absolutely. And after probably the first couple of weeks out there doing shows, I was absolutely hooked. I mean, the fishing was awesome. The scenery is just... I mean, to sit there and fish dry flies and look up and see these mountains looming over you and all the wildlife. The people are awesome. I mean, the people out west are there because they love it. And that really does make people pleasant. I think so. You know, I've lived in places where people aren't very happy. So by the end of the trip, I'd fully made the decision for Janelle and I that we were gonna move out to Livingston, Montana.

Tom Rowland: And what's Janelle's situation at that point?

Derek DeYoung: At that point, she's working for a greeting cards company back in Grand Rapids, Michigan, where her and I both went to art school, and that's where we met. And she had a good steady job, and she's a very hardworking, responsible person. So to just quit her job, pick up, and move out west was a scary thought for her.

Tom Rowland: For anybody.

Derek DeYoung: I flew her out to Bozeman and brought her out to breakfast and told her my idea. This is what we're gonna do. And she just laid her head down on the table and just started crying because she knew that this was really what was gonna happen. And she just... I mean, the idea of Montana, if you haven't been there, is probably that it's just this desolate, like, middle of Alaska. But it's not. You know? It's really got a ton of charm, and I think it offers quite a bit. Although, eventually, what it offered ran out for her, and she wanted to be back in Michigan.

Tom Rowland: But when you're first proposing this idea, had she spent any time out west?

Derek DeYoung: None. None. No. She'd never been out there.

Tom Rowland: So it does seem like a desolate wasteland. And once she got out there and we floated on the Yellowstone River... So you took her out there in the summer?

Derek DeYoung: Yep.

Tom Rowland: Good move.

Derek DeYoung: Yep. You know, I had no idea what it was gonna be like in the winter, and that was even shocking for me. I mean, I grew up in Michigan. We got a good winter. Montana is cruel. It's cold, and it is so windy. It goes up to three weeks with 50-plus mile an hour winds. You can't even get out of your truck without letting go of your door because it's gonna just, you know, hyperextend the hinge. Take it off. So the winter gets long for sure.

Tom Rowland: And so you stayed out there for how long?

Derek DeYoung: We were out in Montana just about nine years.

Tom Rowland: So nine years. And that's full time? Are you coming to visit The Keys part of the year?

Starting DeYoung Studio

Derek DeYoung: So one of my... I'm the dreamer in our relationship. So I propose all the dreams for us to achieve, and Janelle makes them happen. So I'm super lucky that I have a person that can, you know, execute on things. But I've always got all these ideas. And my idea was that we were gonna split time between Montana and The Keys. Two of, in my opinion, the best places on the planet.

Tom Rowland: Agreed.

Derek DeYoung: And she always kinda liked the idea of The Keys, but, again, she was working a nine-to-five corporate job. And I just kept saying, like, you've gotta quit your job and just start working for us. And it was always such a scary proposition for her. Eventually, I started a second company where we produce products with my artwork on it, and that's called DeYoung Studio. And I told her that she had two years. I'd build the company up for two years. She'd help me after working on the weekends, and then she needed to quit her job and take that position over. After, I think, eight months, I said, I'm shutting the doors on this thing because I can't handle it. It's just growing way too fast, or you have to quit right now. And she knew she had no choice. She quit. And instantly, there was just so much opportunity with that business.

Derek DeYoung: And it, you know, that business takes more work than anything I've ever done, but it's really rewarding. It really is. We have to wear so many hats running DeYoung Studio because we're having to source products being made, and we've got a very high quality level to what we're making. So there's no tchotchke items in the whole catalog. It's all nice stuff. So we get samples. We use them. We give them to friends and family and have them use them hard. If it's glassware, we throw it through the dishwasher 200 times. And if it survives that, that's when we move forward next year.

Tom Rowland: So this DeYoung Studio is different than when a company licenses your artwork?

Derek DeYoung: Because we own DeYoung Studio, and we have full control over what products we make. I actually choose what artwork I put on it, so I can put my most relevant new artwork on those products versus, let's say, Simms, who I've worked with for many years now, and that's been a great thing. But they may choose something I did nine years ago. Just because it fits their plan or, you know, what they wanna sell right then. So it's nice to have that control. And it also creates a job for Janelle. And we started that business, and now it's been six years that we've been spending the winter down in The Keys. So it's been an awesome thing.

Fishing First, Art Second

Tom Rowland: So, you know, we were talking earlier. I find that it's very interesting that you're not just spending the winter in The Keys and the summers in Montana just because they're beautiful places and you like that, but it's really about, or as much about, you know, getting to know these fish and the surroundings and the environment and becoming more at home with those fish and then being able to paint them the way that you do. Right?

Derek DeYoung: Well, if I tried to present it as a good business move, that would just be a total lie. I love fishing. Everyone in my family, like, generations deep fishes, and, you know, that's kind of first and foremost on my mind. I wanna fish. I wanna catch fish. The artistic inspiration comes kind of afterwards, but, you know, you can't really think that much about doing a painting when you're fighting a big tarpon like happened tonight. I'm not planning a painting of that fish. I'm trying to beat him up and get him to the boat.

Tom Rowland: Sure. Sure. But in hindsight... I mean, I don't know if this is how you do it or not, but, like, I'll think about that fish that we caught tonight all day tomorrow and weeks after. And in my mind, I will have a snapshot of something for what happened tonight. Just to let everybody know that's listening to this, we basically fished all day and didn't catch anything until the sun went down. Right, I mean, the sun had just crested the horizon, and I'm thinking it's time to go. And we look up, and the mullet's going nuts, and this fish just absolutely crashes it and kills it. And that's my picture of that fish, is when the thing did that cartwheeling deal. That's what I would, if you were to ask me to think of one frame out of the whole deal, that's what I would remember.

Derek DeYoung: Yeah. It's funny how the mind works and what you kinda pick out as that freeze frame of your day. But, Tom, you and Rich both were telling me how much fun putting a mullet on the surface behind the boat and having a tarpon crash on it, and I hadn't done that. You know, you guys kinda built it up, and then it wasn't happening. And I'm like, oh, man. I really did wanna see a tarpon just crush this mullet right on the surface. And that last minute, last second buzzer beater tarpon, I felt... I was holding the rod and felt the mullet go crazy, and I knew for sure there was a fish chasing him. And then, bam, just went tight. The fish jumped and splashed. And it was... I mean, he then went into bulldog mode and just fought me like a Goliath grouper. No more jumping.

Tom Rowland: Well, you know, as you're down here and you have guests at your house tonight, you're gonna entertain them tomorrow, and you're taking them fishing. And it's so funny and kind of a weird situation for somebody who's a fishing guide or somebody who's entertaining someone. And you think about these situations, like, you're saying we built up this mullet because a tarpon eating a mullet is one of the best bites in all of fishing. And if you haven't done it and all you've done is fly fish for them, well, you should see a tarpon eat a mullet because it is pretty awesome. Completely different. It's amazing. Then when you have someone, you bring them on the boat, and you have this situation, and you want to show them that situation, man, is it just gut wrenching? So that situation is not coming to fruition.

Tom Rowland: Like, I mean, all of a sudden, I'm realizing, man, we're running out of time. This is not happening. I don't know what we're gonna do because the story of the show is really good, and I know a lot of people are gonna enjoy it, that, you know, you're an interesting character. You're an artist. People are aware of your art. And now all we gotta do is the fish just need to behave a little bit, which they were not doing. But, you know, that's the thing about fishing is that you really don't know. I mean, we like to think we know, but you really don't know what's going on with the fish and the world.

Derek DeYoung: All the odds were in our favor. There were fish everywhere. And, you know, the weeks and days preceding this, we caught fish. We caught fish. Everybody's got fish. Big Pine's, it's been fantastic. Today looked better and looked like it was gonna happen, and we were in the right spot where they had been feeding. And I don't know. The fish had a mind of their own.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. They had a mind of their own, and they always do. And sometimes you look like a hero, and sometimes you look like the zero. And we were mostly looking like zeros for most of the day, but it worked out, and I'm sure we'll be able to put something nice together. But I enjoyed talking with you today about so many different things, and I really think that the art and the fact that my son is interested in art, and I'm trying to encourage that because, as we were talking about, I think that everyone needs ways that they can express themselves. And I think art is a great way, not just a singular way, but one of the many ways that you can express yourself and kind of get in touch with that creative part of yourself. And so I find it really cool that you figured out not only a way to make a living with your art, but also make a living doing exactly the thing that you also like to do, which is to fish.

Difficult Moments and Sobering Advice

Tom Rowland: And so what I wanted to ask you is, we kinda touched on it just a minute ago, but I'm sure that there was a moment where, and maybe it's that time when you're talking about, man, I'm gonna have to change some things up here, or maybe it's a different moment. But there's a moment when you decide you're burning the boats, you're cashing in all your chips, this is it, and make it or break it. Do you have that moment?

Derek DeYoung: You know, I haven't had that moment recently, but building up to where I'm at now, there's been some difficult moments for sure. Oh, I'll tell you one. When I was back in my days of doing the summer art fairs, my father-in-law, John, who's an investor and just, you know, he's a very intelligent guy and wants to kinda look at numbers with me, make sure that I'm doing a responsible thing here with his daughter. And he's like, Derek, he just takes a pen and a piece of paper. Okay. What's your average painting go for? Oh, well, it's, you know, $600. Okay. $600. And what else are you selling? Prints? Yeah. What do those go for? Okay. $50 each. And how many do you sell per show? Well, on average, maybe eight. Okay. Eight. And how many shows are you doing? When he got done doing this, he came out with, I could make about $12,000 per year. I'm like, oh, holy... I really gotta think about this.

Derek DeYoung: But, you know, in my mind, I would never have broken down those numbers like that. Right? It was sobering. Sobering.

Tom Rowland: Did it help you to say, okay, well, I've gotta figure out...?

Derek DeYoung: You know, I mean, I think that's the difference in a way between successful people and people who kinda just flounder. He is successful, and he did that, and it caused me to change the way I was doing things. But, probably my own nature, I would have just continued on and been like, wait. Why don't we ever have any money?

Tom Rowland: Yeah. Well, there are definitely people that do that, and there are definitely people that get plenty of good advice and continue on a road. It's a different person that looks at that and doesn't see it as someone discouraging them from their dream...

Derek DeYoung: No. No. And sees it as, wow, well, let me...

Tom Rowland: He's right. I need to change a few things.

Derek DeYoung: Let me give you an example because my father-in-law has definitely been a great supporter. He's a creative and passionate guy and has encouraged me to no end in my career. And I give him so much credit. He took his CPA, a longtime friend of the family, and had us meet with him probably eight, ten times to teach us how to run our business. And this was when our business... it's almost a joke to call it a business at that point. But we learned how to run it correctly, and he's assisted us and been a part of running our business all the way till now. And it's been a huge advantage for us to do things right.

Tom Rowland: What do you learn when you're a young person moving into that situation? What are you learning in those little meetings?

Derek DeYoung: Here's how it went. We'd go over to the CPA's house, and his wife would be cooking dinner, and he'd start serving wine. And my ADD would kick in before he even started talking, and I don't really remember anything, but Janelle sat there next to me and actually took notes and listened and would kinda fill me in later. So, yeah, I was super lucky.

Married to a Good Woman

Tom Rowland: Well, you know what? We're very alike in this way that I will tell you. We both married good women.

Derek DeYoung: Yes. Absolutely.

Tom Rowland: And behind every good man is a good woman. And it sounds like... I enjoyed meeting her today, and it just sounds like you and her are perfect together.

Derek DeYoung: You know, it really is an amazing story, and I'm so glad it's the story of my life and my marriage. But to meet someone at art school and to start an art business after art school and learn together how to run it and get better at it over time and be able to utilize both of our skill sets... That's really, you know, really gratifying. I mean, she knows that she's what makes this thing run. And I know that it's up to me and my creativity and my artwork to, you know, make everything look great. So we're both really inspired.

Tom Rowland: Well, that's awesome. I mean, honestly, that's what I kept noticing. I've got kind of a... I try to have a business mind, and I try to look at something. And as I see your artwork keep popping up and keep popping up, and now you're with a different company, or not with a different company, but another company is using your stuff. Licensing your work, or I'm seeing more of your products. I'm noticing, wow, this guy is doing an exceptionally good job of marketing his skills. And as I learned, it's not just you. It's you and Janelle that are doing it. And that makes a lot of sense.

Derek DeYoung: You know, she's there for every meeting, and, you know, together, we're able to deal with what needs to be done. We're maybe not great at each part of this business, but one of us will step up every time.

Designing a Life Between Michigan and The Keys

Tom Rowland: So now you've changed your life a little bit again. You're no longer in Montana. You moved back to Northern Michigan. Right?

Derek DeYoung: Yep.

Tom Rowland: And you're still gonna come visit The Keys. So now you're splitting time between a place that gets snowy and cold and a place that is wonderful and nice in the wintertime. Right?

Derek DeYoung: I'll tell you. We come down here to The Keys right after Christmas, and there's just enough winter that has happened at that point in Northern Michigan that I'm so happy and thankful to be in The Keys. And I'm an outdoor dog. I cannot stand to sit inside. My average day in The Keys, I wake up, take a cup of coffee downstairs, start looking at my artwork and deciding what I need to do. I'm out there all day unless I have to go inside and help Janelle with a project.

Tom Rowland: And how many days a week do you fish?

Derek DeYoung: If the fishing's good and the wind's down, I'll fish every day. That's just kind of part of what I do. But I don't fish, like, twelve hour days. I'll get up an hour before light and go out and hit the sunrise fishing and be back by 10:30 or eleven and get on calls and handle what I need to handle and then get painting. So I'm pretty one dimensional. I guess two dimensional. I like fishing, and I like painting, and I do both every day.

Tom Rowland: Well, you've... that's someone who, in my opinion, has designed a life. You have created a life that is exactly what you want. Kudos to you for doing it. It's awesome.

Weakness Turning Into Strength

Tom Rowland: So I tell the story sometimes to people, and I think I might have told it on the podcast, but I find that, in a lot of ways, when people ask me, you were a fishing guide, and then now you have a TV show, that sounds like a pretty cool life. Like, how in the world do you make that happen? And, you know, I was pretty lucky. A lot of things happened at the right time. When I first started guiding, it was a little bit before River Runs Through It came out, and then as soon as that movie came out, I mean, there were so many people out west wanting to fly fish that pretty much anybody could be full at that point.

Derek DeYoung: Did you have your shadow casting down at that point?

Tom Rowland: Well, you know what? That's a common question back then. Can you show me how to shadow cast? No. I can't. It was about perfect timing. And as I came down here to The Keys and started my business down here, a lot of those trout people had kinda were ready to transition to the saltwater as well. So I came down here and had kind of a full deal, but one of the things that I find interesting when I look in hindsight is when I came to The Keys, I didn't know anything about these fish down here. I had never seen a bonefish. I had caught a tarpon before, but very few. And so I had glaring weaknesses, absolute glaring weaknesses.

Derek DeYoung: And you were guiding immediately?

Tom Rowland: No. No. No. I spent a year on the water learning before I ever took a guided trip.

Derek DeYoung: Thinking, wow. You had great clients.

Tom Rowland: No. It was not like that at all. I'd spent every single day on the water and tried to learn, and I was probably making a little bit of progress. But in my mind, I was making no progress, and that went on for many years. And as I would find some fish, my goal was to move on and find other fish, and move on and move on. And so, if I got into a congested area where there were other guides, I would just leave and go somewhere else and try to find fish. And so the point of this story is that at some point, I realized that my weakness, which was I felt like I had no experience, actually, in turn and in time, turned out to be my greatest strength because I never was content.

Derek DeYoung: You weren't complacent.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. And I had no idea. I also had no idea what all these other people knew or didn't know. And so I just kept going for ten years, like, at that pace of always trying to find something. And I just wonder if you have anything like that in your... you know, do you ever see the theme of weakness turns into strength in the way that you've been able to create this life and your business that you have?

Derek DeYoung: I absolutely think that's the case with me.

Tom Rowland: What was your weakness that turns out to be a strength?

Derek DeYoung: Well, I mean, with our business, I'm the worst perfectionist, and everything has to be right. And, I mean, to a degree that most people would be like, come on. Seriously? Like, it's not that big a deal, but it is to me. And, you know, once I step back or the next day, I can kinda see, well, maybe I shoulda let that one slide. But, no, I've gotta have it all perfect.

Tom Rowland: So is that a weakness or is that a strength?

Derek DeYoung: Well, I mean, it can probably be pretty annoying to my wife, but I have some sense that, like, if any color's wrong, you know, on the hat, if the signature's the wrong color, that I just can't let that slide. But I'm the same way with my artwork. I'm super particular about how things are done. I'll give you an example. We're putting out a new line of hats, and all the signatures were, like, the same color. They weren't, you know, color dropped from the artwork of each particular hat. And when I wanted them redone, we had to kinda go back four steps to get the file back and redo it because they were already at the manufacturer of the hat. And I'm like, no. No. Pull them back. Stop production. Don't do it. We need to change this. And Janelle kinda gave me a look, and I'm like, do you know that, like, with my paintings, I'd say half the time, I sign it, wipe it off, and sign it a different color because I just can't stand the color that I chose first. So it's just the same mindset. I gotta see it, and if it looks right, move forward. If it doesn't, redo it.

Derek DeYoung: And so I'm still trying to determine whether that's a weakness or a strength.

Tom Rowland: Well, first of all, it's a strength because you want it all to be perfect.

Derek DeYoung: It's a strength because I truly do care that much, and that leads to my stuff, I think, looking right. And it's a weakness because it's just truly annoying probably to other people who are involved in the process.

The Sketchbook and the Walleye Drawing

Derek DeYoung: I've got a quick story about when I was in art school, and I've talked to my wife, Janelle, about this so many times because our majors were just so different. She was in multimedia editing and graphic design, and I was in illustration. And I did well in school and kinda thought that I had, I don't know, a good position there. But I had this one professor, and I had to turn in a sketchbook. And you had to be sketching for, whatever, an hour a night. I was doing more than that. I always did far more than what was asked of me when I was in school. So I thought when he saw my sketchbook, yeah, he was just gonna, like, stand up and be like, class, come take a look at Derek's sketchbook. This is what I want of you. I mean, I was so sure of it because I felt like the sketches were good. There was much more than an hour per night in there. He opened it up, and I hadn't dated every sketch, and there weren't descriptions of my ideas. Essentially, I didn't show the math. You know? I just did the drawings. He closed it right back up, threw it across his desk. It fell on the floor and stuff fell out of it. And he goes, don't ever turn anything like this into me again. And if you're gonna go out and try to be an artist in the real world, good luck. And I was so shocked, but the funny thing is that's the exact treatment that makes me work harder. Like, if you tell me, like, yeah, do not even show me this, I'm like, okay. Let's go. I'm gonna do so much better.

Tom Rowland: Well, that's kinda what happened to you when you told me the story on the interview for the show today about going to your first art show. Right?

Derek DeYoung: Yeah. I mean, I'm failure motivated.

Tom Rowland: So in your first art show, let's just recap that real quick. You go there. You feel like...

Derek DeYoung: Well, first experience, first taste of defeat was, there's a MUCC, which is the Michigan United Conservation Clubs. They hold an annual youth wildlife art competition. And, shoot, I was a big deal in, you know, my neck of the woods. I thought for sure I was gonna win this art competition, and I entered a pencil drawing of a walleye that my dad had caught and was mounted on our wall in the basement. And I had all kinds of detail in there and little minnows and stuff, and we went to Lansing to go to the actual art show and the exhibit and to see, you know, the blue ribbon on my artwork. Except when we got there, there was not even an honorable mention on it. And it was the most sobering moment, I think, of my life. Like, holy cow. I'm really not as good as I think I am. On the drive home, we were all kinda sulking. Even my parents kind of were shocked that I didn't win. My dad kinda turns around and looks at me. He's like, well, maybe it's time you start taking art lessons. And he was right. That was the right thing to say at that very moment because I took my disappointment and it motivated me to start taking weekly art lessons. And at that point, you know, my brain was just a sponge. So I was working under a local artist who had a good name for himself in the area and taught me all the basics and everything I needed to know. I mean, I knew more in sixth grade than most of the art students just from the school system knew in twelfth grade. I mean, I'd already done it all. So it was just such an advantage and gave me such confidence as I moved forward.

The Right Words at the Right Moment

Tom Rowland: Now what a difference that is that your dad chose to say that. Like, maybe it's time you take some art lessons. He's still being supportive, and he's still trying to help, but he's also kinda hitting you with reality there. What a difference that is from someone else saying, well, those judges just don't know what they're talking about. Right? Like, how would that have affected you if that was the advice at that point? You know, a helicopter parent saying...

Derek DeYoung: Well, if he said those judges don't know what they're talking about, that would mean he was, like, saying it's not for me. That's not my dad. My dad's gonna say what he thinks about any situation. And he's gonna be truthful with you, and sometimes that's hard to hear, but it actually, you know, I appreciate it.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. Sometimes those are the kind of people that you need in your life, are the people that are gonna tell you how it is, and they're gonna tell you in a way that it's motivating rather than, you know, it could at that moment, it could destroy you. I mean, that's a very...

Derek DeYoung: It was a critical moment. Critical moment. It really was. And, yeah, I've met... shoot. It's crazy to think back about an early childhood thing affecting your entire life, but it did. It absolutely does.

Tom Rowland: I mean, I can think of many different turning points in my life for many different things that, you know, it's a few minutes of your life that really make a huge difference in the direction that you choose to take it and how hard you work at those things and whether or not you're gonna be successful. I mean, there's tons of those moments, and the funny thing is we never know when those moments are. As a parent, I never know when those moments are that I'm doing that with my kids and just hoping that I'm not taking it the other way. You know? You're just, as a parent, you're just kinda hoping that you're doing it right. I guess if you're just being aware that any one of these moments could mean something really profound or it could really destroy somebody's confidence. So you just have to be careful.

Derek DeYoung: I think that, you know, maybe you put too much pressure, or people do as a parent, to say the right thing in that moment because I think it all comes together. You know what I mean? All the times that the kids spend with you.

Tom Rowland: You're right. You're right.

Derek DeYoung: You know, I knew my dad had confidence in me that I was gonna, you know, get better from this. It wasn't necessarily just that moment. I knew from past experience that he thought I was really good. But that moment was really, you know, the expression of that.

What's Next: Trout Art and Acrylic Pours

Tom Rowland: That's cool. So what's next for DeYoung Studio and beyond? What's next?

Derek DeYoung: Well, we head back up north here in the next couple weeks, and I'm excited for that. And I've got quite a bit of trout artwork that I'm gonna be doing, so it'll be good to change gears, change palettes, be reaching for warmer colors. Get up there and watch spring set in up north.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. That's cool. And when you say change palettes and stuff like that, that's another thing that has really intrigued me about you, is the ability to... or I don't know if it's ability. You tell me what it is, but you're often working in different types of art. Why is that? Or how is that?

Derek DeYoung: It's pure boredom. My mind gets so bored doing the same thing over that I have to try it new ways or try new styles, or if I see something that inspires me to try to, you know, work that into what I'm doing as a fish artist. That's just kind of my personality.

Tom Rowland: But I love the pour. We went to Derek's studio this morning and did an interview with him, and then he showed us these acrylic pours that you're doing. And that was super interesting. I've never seen anything like that before.

Derek DeYoung: Well, they're getting super popular, and I saw one on Instagram, I think, last fall. And I just thought, you know what? When we get down to Florida, I'm gonna order all the stuff to do it, and I'm gonna play with this. And it's been so much fun. And, you know, it's a slow learning curve because you add a little too much of this, and it doesn't turn out, or you put too much paint and it cracks or this or that happens. But what's been fun too is all the people have come down and hung out with us. I do a pour with them and just to see how much joy they get from it. Because, you know, I do art every day, and I'm just so used to it. Most people do not. So to let them choose colors and let them, you know, tilt the canvas and get it right and flick the silicone on it.

Tom Rowland: What do you think it is about art and being creative, when you see somebody that doesn't have that in their life and you see that joy that it gives them, what do you think it is?

Derek DeYoung: It brings the best out of them. I mean, there's something so satisfying about it. And, usually, they're instantly thinking, oh, I'm gonna get this stuff. I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna try it on my cabinet doors. I'm gonna do a whole wall of little panels of this. And, you know, whether they do or they don't, it's cool to watch their mind kinda take hold on it.

Tom Rowland: And then I think, really, when you have the outlet for creativity is when you do have all that stuff, and then you have some time to get down there. You're not necessarily just over their shoulder all the time. They're able to play with it themselves and with failure and success. Right? Like, that's...

Derek DeYoung: Well, Janelle was trying it with doing some pours with me, and, you know, she just doesn't spend as much time kinda honing the skills to do it. And she's getting mad that hers weren't turning out. So she's like, I don't need to do them anymore. I'm done with them. So we get to that point too, I guess. But, you know...

Tom Rowland: It's all supposed to be fun, though. Right?

Derek DeYoung: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Fishing as an Art Form

Tom Rowland: And then you get that creativity. You satisfy that in some way. And lots of people have other ways of satisfying it. It may not be as an artist. Maybe you're a fishing guide, and your art is, yeah, fly time. Of course, that's something, but there could also be the art of being able to take somebody out in the boat and show them a great time and teach them things in a way that they weren't expecting. And they come away from the day, you know, with a greater understanding of the environment that they're in and the fish that they're looking for and the things that they eat and the birds that inhabit the whole deal. I don't know. I mean, that in itself is kind of a...

Derek DeYoung: It's kind of a gift to give somebody, you know, as a guide. When you look at it that way, not just a job, but to have an opportunity, you know, to affect people. I think that's really cool. And I'm sure there's lots of guides out there like that.

Tom Rowland: Oh, there are. I mean, there are guides just like there are artists. There are guides, you know, there are artists that are at the top of their craft like yourself, and you're doing everything, and you're working every single day all day long to get better and to grow as an artist. And there are those fishing guides out there that every single day, they're writing in their journal and doing everything they possibly can to get better and, you know, it's cloudy today or the wind was blowing in this direction, and they just had no idea what to do. Well, they're gonna fix that because the next time it's cloudy and blowing in this direction, they're not gonna sit at home. They're gonna actually be out there. That's the day they're looking forward to so they can figure out how to fish on a north wind if they're used to a south wind or east wind or west wind or whatever it is because, honestly, the conditions are not good most of the time. But people, you know, that's when someone takes whatever they're doing to an art form, is when they're working on it all the time and getting better and better each time, and it's really great when that's all to help someone else do something, whatever your profession is. I mean, fishing guides, it's easy because you're trying to help people to have a good time, but your artwork is super cool, man, and I really look forward to what you have going on.

A Podcast in a Car

Tom Rowland: And if you're hearing what sounds like a road, it is. We're actually doing this podcast in a car. It's the first one ever in a car. Derek's actually doing hand signals on which way I should turn to get to his house.

Derek DeYoung: I didn't have to give you any direction.

Tom Rowland: No. No. I'm doing pretty good right now, but this is where you get lost right up in here, I think. This is the one? Okay. Well, cool. Well, I wanna thank you for doing this with us, both the television show and then doing the first podcast in a car. It was a first for me, and it was so much fun. I really appreciated you having me. We're gonna do it again, man. You're a great guest. You got a great story. You love to fish.

A Shared Love of Barracuda

Tom Rowland: And one of the things that I have really enjoyed about your artwork is the barracuda, and I think that you just nail it.

Derek DeYoung: A fellow barracuda lover.

Tom Rowland: I love... dude, if it swims and you can catch it, I'm in, but I love the barracuda. And in Key West in the wintertime, that was our fish. I mean, we went out, and we caught barracudas. These guys up here in the Upper Keys, they could go redfish and snook fish and stuff like that. When it got cold, we fished for barracudas, and some of the greatest days that I can ever remember were associated with barracudas, and I just love them.

Derek DeYoung: I've taken my dad out, for instance, and put him on a tarpon, and then we caught a couple of cudas. And we got back in, and he's like, I think I liked the cudas better.

Tom Rowland: Well, I mean, they're super fast. They have an amazing bite, and I don't know. You can catch a lot of them in a day sometimes, and then when you pick them up, they are just nasty looking and cool looking and just, I don't know, but very few people that I've seen can really nail the barracuda as an artist. And I think that you've got it with a number of your pieces.

Derek DeYoung: So appreciate it.

Tom Rowland: So I wanna go cuda fishing with you. We'll do another show.

Derek DeYoung: I'd like that. Let's go out to the Marquesas and chase them in the winter.

Tom Rowland: That is really an area that I have spent a lot of time and like that area. We did a show with Mike Pollock last year where we went out there and did nothing but barracuda fish. It's a great place because the water is just so clear and nice just like you have here in Big Pine, but there there's some big ones.

Derek DeYoung: There's some monsters that live out there.

Tom Rowland: Yeah. Well, we'll do it, and we'll make it happen. And thanks again for doing this podcast and sticking with us when the fishing wasn't good.

Derek DeYoung: Hey. I'm out here all the time. I don't catch fish every day.

Tom Rowland: You're the real deal, man. Thank you. I appreciate it, Derek.

Derek DeYoung: Absolutely.

Where to Find Derek's Art

Tom Rowland: Hey. If anybody wants to go find your stuff, tell them how they can get ahold of you.

Derek DeYoung: My website is just my name. It's derekdeyoung.com. D-E-Y-O-U-N-G.

Tom Rowland: Yep. D-E-R-E-K D-E-Y-O-U-N-G. Okay. That's where they can go and get all that. That's where I'm looking at your truck wrap with a black pickup truck.

Derek DeYoung: Yep. It's got a big brown trout face on it.

Tom Rowland: And buy all that stuff there.

Derek DeYoung: Oh, yeah. It's all on the site.

Tom Rowland: Cool. Alright, man. Thanks, Derek. See you next time.

Closing Thoughts

Tom Rowland: Hey, everybody. Thank you so much for listening to the show. I hope you got something out of that. Got just a little bit of news. We have started a weekly show that is designed to be up-to-the-minute videos of what's happening this week, mostly in the Florida Keys, but also in other places that we fish as well. We'll be putting that out every week, and the best way to find that is to subscribe to the YouTube channel. YouTube slash Saltwater Experience. Search Saltwater Experience on YouTube. Subscribe to that channel, and you will get updates of when a new video is published.

Tom Rowland: I've also figured out how to put the podcast on YouTube, finally. A lot of people like to put that window behind other things they're working on and listen to the podcast while they are working. So we now have that for you, and there is a playlist called podcast. There's a playlist called weekly show. You can go and see all the new videos that we're putting up there. Started a new email address specifically for this show, and that is podcast@saltwaterexperience.com. Those emails come directly to me. I'll see every single one of them. So if you have comments, suggestions, ways we can make the show better, and particularly if you have suggestions for a motivational, inspirational character, or someone that can teach us all something, I'm very interested in your suggestions. So that's podcast@saltwaterexperience.com.

Tom Rowland: You can get the podcast on iTunes, Stitcher, Spotify, SoundCloud, and we're also publishing it on the blog. The weekly show will be published on the blog too, but the best way is to go to YouTube, subscribe there, and you'll get it immediately when it's published. So until next week, thanks for listening, and we'll see you soon.